Linux

[MorseLady]

I would like to play with Linux-Mandrake version 7 which is on a CDROM with a SAMS book. I cannot find a Linux Forum on here and as I am a complete newbie to Linux I would like to know where I can yell for help if it all goes wrong?

[NooNoo]

This is as good a forum as any Morse Lady... just use this thread and the linux lovers will help out I am sure!

[MorseLady]

Thanks Noo, will do. I am going to read the book first then I will jump in using my second computer of course. Nice to know that if I encounter any problems I can get advice.

[confus-ed]

Originally posted by NooNoo
This is as good a forum as any Morse Lady... just use this thread and the linux lovers will help out I am sure!

Can we not have one back then ? (A linux forum that is) ... not that I know anything at all about it really - which is I guess why I'd like the 'safety net' of a forum just for it ...

But Scott seems to have officially 'killed' xdrivers (previous wd linux forum) ... I did make an appeal on another thread in comments & suggestions ... but it seems only I was bothered, I'm sure others are (like here) ... but so far my cries go unanswered !! :eek2: :D

[MorseLady]

Good idea Confus-ed. I get the impression talking to other IT students at College that quite a few Windows types also play with Linux and other things.

Wasn't there a Web Design Forum once? It would be nice to see a Forum for Web Design and Graphics.

[MorseLady]

Having read the Installation part of the book I thought I would walk through the Installation of Linux-Mandrake 7 and have already encountered two problems and have aborted the installation without harm to my dual boot Windows ME/W2K Server computer.

l. I read in the book that it is very hard to get Linux to work with internal modems and impossible it it's Winmodem as mine is.

2. I booted to the CD and it was easy (I selected Recommended Install)until I got to the partitioning stage but it only showed my disk as one whole drive instead of one NTFS Primary partition, one FAT32 Primary Partition and one Logical FAT32 Partition. This is where I got scared and did a runner!

I love installing Windows, even 2K Server and W3X/DOS,but this is scary!

Could I create the Linux Partition in Partition Magic and set it in Boot Magic, boot into the empty Linux formatted partition from the CD and install? I still have an external modem I could use but it is only 28k. Can you use Linux with Broadband?

[geoscomp]

Linux is fun, but can be a little confusing to the new user..there are a number of tutorial sites out there, like this one on partitions (http://www.linuxplanet.com/linuxplanet/tutorials/4269/4/) , that might be of help. You need two partitions for a linux install..the root and the swap partition. A lot of people use more. You can indeed use pq magic and boot magic, but I would only suggest that if you are already using boot magic for your multiboot setup

[MorseLady]

Thanks for the link. I do most of my partitioning in PM7 although I have used Disk Management in W2K/XP too. At the moment I have three partitions on a 15GB HDD holding ME on FAT32, W2K Server on NTFS and a logical storage/bridge partition on FAT32. My system partition is ME and is tied to the special HP BIOS.

To be honest, I am scared of a system I know nothing about and which is completely alien to my Windows experience and training as it does seem to make some drastic configuration changes to the MBR etc. Maybe I will buy a used low end Pentium at a Computer Fair and use that for Linux.

[NooNoo]

I have a nice p200mmx sitting here....

[MorseLady]

Noo wrote I have a nice p200mmx sitting here....

I assume you are telling me Linux runs well on a low end Pentium and that's what you use? I have a 486DX with 16MB and 340MB HDD but it's not enough for this version of Linux. I use it for playing with DOS and WIN 3x or WIN 95 which will just run on it. Sometimes I put 3x on and the Calmira Win95 emulator - no registry changes and little overhead, great for small machines. See http://www.calmira.org/ for more info on Calmira.

We have a shop here who used to sell old corporate machines real cheap but they only sell high end secondhand stuff.

I was going to take the Linux book and CD back to the Library but I will hang on to it and read some more.

Got a school Reunion today will probably not be able to get back to any replies on here until tommorow.

[NooNoo]

It depends on what linux you run and what you want it to do, but yes, a low end pentium is fine.

[craigmodius]

I don't think you'd even have to worry about a whole new PC for Linux if you're not comfortable with the dual boot idea.

Just get a second hard drive and install Linux on there. You could even physically disconnect the other hdd just to be on the safe side.

I have a dual boot setup with win98 and redhat 7.2 so I can't say as I'm any help with the PM/Mandrake setup.

Once you get that going you might want to start here (http://www.linmodems.org/) on the whole winmodem issue.

Oh, and as you've probably figured by now backup, backup, backup. And when you've done that make sure you backup. :D

[gtiseb]

welcom morse lady!

i'm an avid linux user ( i do use mandrake alot) and I have to agree for a newbie coming from windows it can be scary. However there's a couple of things you need to know first:

1. a pentium 200 won't cut it if you plan to run a desktop. It would be fine if you were running a command line only server (which linux rocks at) but if you want to do any GUI stuff , you'll need more power (about the same as windows)

2. That being said, the easiest way to get linux to run without ruining you other partitions, is to buy another HD and add it on and choose that blank hd during the linux install procedure as you linux drive. this will keep you windows intact and let you switch to linux when you need too (hint: when you want to remove linux completely, just do a FDISK /MBR to restore the normal windows boot-loader)

3. most windmodems will not work with the version of mandrake you're using (which is a pretty old version but a good one to start with). I'm running mandrake 9.1 and it does recognise some winmodems but not all. a gootd hardware modem is always better in the long run but if you're on broadband I wouldn't worry too much about it.

4. The best piece of advice i can give you is try not to think too much in a WINDOWS way when you use the linux Desktop. when I started out I made this mistake and it really slowed me down, until A friend suggested I stop thinking like i'm in windows. you'd be surprised how much windows has made us do what IT wants instead of what WE want.

5. If you need anyother help, you can certainly ask me here in the forums or in the chat room, I'm usually there during the day eastern time.

[MorseLady]

Thank you very much for your very informative and helpful replies and as I said I went out yersterday so could not reply right away as I got home late.

Craigmodius, I am very happy with dual and multibooting with most versions of Windows, but with Linux it's all this setting up swap partitions and what seems like fundamental changes to the disc which worries me. So what you and gtiseb say about a second hard drive makes sense. I will have a look inside the HP Pavilion machine and see what provision I have got to install one and I need to do some other hardware and memory upgrades anyway. I have a 1GB hard drive in my box but I guess I will buy a new and bigger one?

gtiseb, thank you for your kind offer of help and your advice re versions is noted. Yes, I was aware that Mandrake version 7 was a bit old and presumably that's why it's free with a book! Is there a version of Linux I could buy which is not too expensive and which is easier for the newbie - how about Red Hat?

I am not on Broadband yet but will be just a soon as I sort out some awkward cable routing issues with my provider and why they won't let me install it on more than one machine. I will be posting questions on this issue on the appropriate Forum here. Yes, both computers have soft WinModems.

Looks like I have got myself a trip to the computer store this afternoon.

I get the impression that I am not the only Windows User Newbie to Linux who is scared? I feel the need to try it and how can I judge Windows unless I have at least tried other things?

Thanks again, what would I do without Windrivers Forums :D

[delmer_1]

I too recently attempted a dual boot with windows and linux, and it can be very confusing. I had a 30gb ntfs drive for windows XP, an 80gb ntfs drive for data, and i added another 30gb drive, made a 15gb fat32 partition for sharing files between windows and linux...and 15gb unpartitioned space that i used for my Red Hat 9 install. Red Hat is the only version of linux that i tried, but the install of it was pretty simple.

the problems come up when you want to actually do something with your computer. I dont know about the other versions, but red hat took some configuring before i got it where it was even remotly functional. There is no MP3 support out of the box, so you have to download and try to install it. That will probably be the hardest thing to adjust to, installing software is a big ridiculous task, often requiring the use of the command line.

I am not trying to hijack your thread, but i just wanted to bring up a few problems I am having, as you may have them as well.

when trying to access my fat32 partition, i have read only access to it. and I have to remount it all the time. I boot to windows, dump my MP3s and misc stuff onto teh fat32 partition, and then i can play them from linux, but i cant' save anything to that drive unless logged in as ROOT. is there a way to automatically mount this drive at startup, and somehow have write access to the drive when logged in as myself?

ALso, trying to install Java is impossible. I did manage to get netscape going, but i cant install java. is there an easy way?



If you are looking for a different version to try, go here:

http://linuxiso.org/

you can download the disk image and burn them, and since it is open source, it is legal.(at least to the best of my knowlege, if this is not true, please let me know) however if you are not on broadband, it will take forever so you might want to either buy it, or wait until you get broadband. Lycoris is a nice, USER FRIENDLY version. it has a very xp like interface and seems to be the easiest to configure, however it doesnt like my RAID controller, so it only boots if i disconnect my other hard drives and connect my linux drive as primary master.

yes, you can get linux working with broadband. I have redhat 9 working fine with my pppoe DSL connection.

sorry I am not much help, as I am a linux newbie as well. It is nice to see that I am not alone.

[MorseLady]

Hello delmer_1

No, you are not hijacking my thread at all, it's an open Forum and I am glad of the company on this topic. I am very grateful for your comments.

I have put Linux on hold for now because I have some big problems with Windows I ought to sort out but please keep this thread going and maybe Scott will give us a Linux Forum (Scott, Noo, PLEASE can we have a Linux/Unix Forum :thumbs2: sorry there is no smilie for "grovel"! Thank you in advance (now I am really grovelling ;) )

[delmer_1]

I have pretty much put mine on hold as well. I have it installed and the dual boot is working fine, but i haven't booted to red hat in a few weeks. i just get frustrated with it. I really wish i could get lycoris working with a dual boot and XP, it is more dumbed down for us linux newbies. it instantly detected my fat32 partition and mounted it for me. it also has a My Computer like area, which is nice for us who are used to windows. and also has a cool feature..when you move the mouse over an mp3 file, it plays, when you move the mouse away from it, it stops. makes it nice for finding a certain song when you dont remember which one it was....maybe someday it will work..until then, i am going to try to stick with red hat.

[craigmodius]

when trying to access my fat32 partition, i have read only access to it. and I have to remount it all the time. I boot to windows, dump my MP3s and misc stuff onto teh fat32 partition, and then i can play them from linux, but i cant' save anything to that drive unless logged in as ROOT. is there a way to automatically mount this drive at startup, and somehow have write access to the drive when logged in as myself?

Forgive me because I'm not running under Linux right now so the details may be fuzzy...

but what you need to do is set up the mount in your etc/fstab file. When I set mine up I copy and paste a line from another device like a hdd and modify it to match the settings for the fat32 partition (vfat instead of ext3 that sort of thing) To get around the permissions thing I would log in as root and set the permissions of the mount point to all users or set a shortcut to the mount point (might be mounted at /mnt/vfat or wherever you choose in the earlier step) to run as root.

ALso, trying to install Java is impossible. I did manage to get netscape going, but i cant install java. is there an easy way?

Been a while on that one, but if you're trying to set it up under Mozilla, I think NS and Moz have different spots for plugins despite what the directions were telling me if I went to NS and typed about: plugins (without the space) in the address bar it referenced some directory like for example "/usr/lib/netscape/plugins" and if I went over to Mozilla and did the same thing it told me "/usr/lib/mozilla/plugins" so try typing that in both browsers and jot them down. Since NS is working do the same thing to Moz just copy the plugin files to the different directory that Mozilla wants.

The mp3 support was indeed a chore to get going until I downloaded xmms and even then the player wasn't exactly user friendly

(Lycoris) has a cool feature..when you move the mouse over an mp3 file, it plays, when you move the mouse away from it, it stops

I believe you can do this in RedHat if you are using the Konqueror file manager ( I don't know if RH9 still uses it) under KDE you can set up auto preview options, somewhere from a 'preferences' or 'options. menu item, to auto preview sound files and pictures and I think mp3 files was one of the sound files it would natively preview.

Software is a beast to try to get working, especially with all the dependencies which depend on other dependencies which need still yet other dependencies :rolleyes:

I tried to setup a Samsung Digital Camera and a Handspring PDA and got tired of cruising around the internet trying to find the right version of a package only to install it and have it crap out halfway thru because it needed another package from somewhere else. It felt like a wild goose chase/scavenger hunt.

Maybe I'll tryout RH9 :)

[NooNoo]

Moved to Linux forum :D :cool:

[MorseLady]

Noo, Scott and whoever else was involved THANK YOU VERY MUCH for this Linux Forum :D :) :) :cool:

[+Daemon+]

first off if your new to linux using the version of mandrake you are it might be best to get the lastest version I think its 9, also red hat 9 is very nice and ez to learn...

but if you want to play around with linux with out installing it on a hard drive try this:

http://www.knoppix.org/

you can download there img/iso file burn it to cd then boot of the cd and linux will run off the cd if you want to check out how linux runs/works Xwindows is also included on the cdrom :)

[Dark Millennium]

Originally posted by +Daemon+
first off if your new to linux using the version of mandrake you are it might be best to get the lastest version I think its 9, also red hat 9 is very nice and ez to learn...

but if you want to play around with linux with out installing it on a hard drive try this:

http://www.knoppix.org/

you can download there img/iso file burn it to cd then boot of the cd and linux will run off the cd if you want to check out how linux runs/works Xwindows is also included on the cdrom :)

Its 9.1 as of this writing.....

And I agree with the Knoppix. I just discovered their site, I may play with it later.

As to what version I run, I had stayed primarily with Red hat, though I have tried Mandrake from time to time.

I recommend staying away from DEBIAN. Its rather confusing and many thing you would think would be installed by default are not, such as networking.... (Definetly geared more for developers). :)

On a side note, another Linux version which runs off a cd can be found here
Linux-bbc (http://www.lnx-bbc.com/)

[confus-ed]

You may care to hit a geek bookshop & pick yourself up 'rehhat 9 & Bible' .... you get an excellant 1000 page mannual which shows you pretty much everything a linux newbie might care to know ... from client setup through server setup even onto more advanced topics like linking to say a mac network .... :cool:

Usually I'm tighter than a scotsman with short arms ! :D ... but I highly recommend this ... not so much for the distro (I couldn't tell you a good one from a bad one!) But for the 'bible' bit (the mannual) worth the purchase price (about £30 ) on its own !! ;)

[+Daemon+]

also a unix for dummies is good. Get to know unix/linux commands (dos like commands :))