'Linux fried my LG CDROM drive??'

[darkhorse]

Someone pointed me to this (http://www.mandrakelinux.com/en/errata.php3#badlg) article.

Apparently Mandrake Linux 9.2 and LG CDROM drives do not mix :eek:


Error scenario: Installing 9.2 and being told unable to install the base system and subsequent reboot reveals that CD-ROM drive is physically dead.
Why: According to LG Electronics, their ODD (Optical Disc Drive) products do not support Linux nor do they test with Linux. Unfortunately, many Dell computers (possibly others) come with these CD-ROM drives.
Solution: Currently there is no solution or work-around for this issue; it is still under investigation. Damage occurs even when doing a network install. At this point, please do not install Mandrake Linux 9.2 on any computer containing a LG-based CD-ROM drive or it will damage your CD-ROM drive! We are actively looking for a solution to this problem.

[TripleRLtd]

Someone pointed me to this (http://www.mandrakelinux.com/en/errata.php3#badlg) article.

Apparently Mandrake Linux 9.2 and LG CDROM drives do not mix :eek:Perhaps the drive won't work but a driver (which is software) WILL NOT cause damage to hardware unless it is a flashable bios upgrade or firmware upgrade.
It is like a virus.
A virus can do much damage, but it will not do any physical damage to a hard drive.
The same with drivers for CDRom drives.
Also, why do you need a driver for a CD drive in the first place???

[DocPC]

Perhaps the drive won't work but a driver (which is software) WILL NOT cause damage to hardware unless it is a flashable bios upgrade or firmware upgrade.
It is like a virus.
A virus can do much damage, but it will not do any physical damage to a hard drive.
The same with drivers for CDRom drives.
Also, why do you need a driver for a CD drive in the first place???


Untrue....the Chernobyl virus killed motherboards as well as hard drives.......

[TripleRLtd]

Untrue....the Chernobyl virus killed motherboards as well as hard drives....... Sorry Doc, but tis true:
Remember I said flashable BIOS.
From Symantec:

The first payload overwrites the hard disk with random data, starting at the beginning of the disk (sector 0) using an infinite loop. The overwriting of the sectors does not stop until the system has crashed. As a result, the computer will not boot from the hard disk or floppy disk. Also, the data that has been overwritten on the hard disk will be very difficult or impossible to recover. You must restore the data from backups.

The second payload tries to cause permanent damage to the computer. This payload attacks the Flash BIOS (a part of your computer that initializes and manages the relationships and data flow between the system devices, including the hard drive, serial and parallel ports, and the keyboard) and tries to corrupt the data stored there. As a result, nothing may be displayed when you start the computer. A computer technician would need to fix this.
So, software attacks software!!!!

[DocPC]

We shall see........I would wait on other comments. :)

[TripleRLtd]

We shall see........I would wait on other comments. :)But I won't...
...just admit it.
Is it so hard???http://forums.windrivers.com/cgi-bin/wd/images/smilies/moon.gif

[jaeger]

Hmm, software can't physically kill hardware? Seem to remember a slight screwup a while ago where a certain Nvidia driver set neglected to turn a gpu fan up during 3D screensavers, resulting in the odd dead card. Course, you have an out from any perspective, since the only way to run any computer is via some form of code. Nevertheless, software coding mistakes can kill hardware. Ya might wanna be a bit more respectful of DocPC. He may stink like infected arse, but he does know his business.

[darkhorse]

Certain LG models that receive the 'flush cache' command understand this to be a 'firmware update' command. And if the data flowing is not that of the firmware... :eek2:

[TripleRLtd]

Ah, so again, as jaeger puts it, some type of coding.
It's almost like "Sticks and stones may break your bones, but words will never hurt you".
Remember that one?
Well, what if the words indirectly cause a heart attack?
PS,
As for Doc, I was just returning a favor.http://forums.windrivers.com/cgi-bin/wd/images/smilies/smile.gifhttp://forums.windrivers.com/cgi-bin/wd/images/smilies/thumbs.gif

[TripleRLtd]

Seem to remember a slight screwup a while ago where a certain Nvidia driver set neglected to turn a gpu fan up during 3D screensavers, resulting in the odd dead card. Course, you have an out from any perspective, since the only way to run any computer is via some form of code. Nevertheless, software coding mistakes can kill hardware. . I assume you mean turn the speed of the gpu fan up, but the fan was still working? And, the card died? Many manufacturers of Nvidia cards only use heat sinks, so would that be why this card you refer to died?

[DocPC]

But I won't...
...just admit it.
Is it so hard???http://forums.windrivers.com/cgi-bin/wd/images/smilies/moon.gif

It may be or may not mean anything, but I have on my desk a NEW 6.4GB laptop drive that was hit by Chernobyl years ago. There is nothing physically wrong with it, it just won't work.

Also I have an old MB that was hit by the same virus. Hot-swapped the bios, etc. Still will not work.

Are they physically damaged or is it something else?

I have tinkered with these 2 parts for years.......never could get them to work again.

[TripleRLtd]

It may be or may not mean anything, but I have on my desk a NEW 6.4GB laptop drive that was hit by Chernobyl years ago. There is nothing physically wrong with it, it just won't work.

Also I have an old MB that was hit by the same virus. Hot-swapped the bios, etc. Still will not work.

Are they physically damaged or is it something else?

I have tinkered with these 2 parts for years.......never could get them to work again. That is interesting.
Personally, as well as thankfully, I never came upon Chernobyl with any of my customers.
With the dirive, can you not do a "factory" low-level format and then rewrite to it?
With the board, perhaps Ruslan could get in on this, but did you replace it with a compatable flash rom?

[DocPC]

That is interesting.
Personally, as well as thankfully, I never came upon Chernobyl with any of my customers.
With the dirive, can you not do a "factory" low-level format and then rewrite to it?
With the board, perhaps Ruslan could get in on this, but did you replace it with a compatable flash rom?

The drive was low-level formatted, checked sector-by sector, fdisked, etc.....keep in mind I have been messing with it for years. I think at one time I even sent it back to IBM with the response that it was not salvageable from the virus having damaged it, therefore no RMA.

As for the board, it is no longer worth anything....takes a max PII450. It's just a matter of tinkering now.

I replaced the the BIOS with 2 known working chips by hot-swapping them. The BIOS chips will work fine in other boards after I remove them from the "Chernobyl" one, but not in it.

[TripleRLtd]

The drive was low-level formatted, checked sector-by sector, fdisked, etc.....keep in mind I have been messing with it for years. I think at one time I even sent it back to IBM with the response that it was not salvageable from the virus having damaged it, therefore no RMA.

As for the board, it is no longer worth anything....takes a max PII450. It's just a matter of tinkering now.

I replaced the the BIOS with 2 known working chips by hot-swapping them. The BIOS chips will work fine in other boards after I remove them from the "Chernobyl" one, but not in it. Well then, perhaps I AM wrong and deserve one of these:http://forums.windrivers.com/cgi-bin/wd/images/smilies/moon.gif (http://forums.windrivers.com/cgi-bin/wd/misc.php?do=getsmilies#)
The confluence of hardware and software and the various dependencies is getting scarier by the day.http://forums.windrivers.com/cgi-bin/wd/images/smilies/eek3.gif

[imagoon]

Certain LG models that receive the 'flush cache' command understand this to be a 'firmware update' command. And if the data flowing is not that of the firmware... :eek2:

If that is the issue then they should be shidded for making non standard hardware, or not following the standard to a tee.

~Chris

[NooNoo]

Moved to linux forum....

[Platypus]

If that is the issue then they should be shidded for making non standard hardware, or not following the standard to a tee.

~Chris

Seems LG just say their drives don't support Linux.

Another list of known susceptible and OK drives:

http://groups.google.com/groups?dq=&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&safe=off&selm=381enb.fs9.ln%40news.it.uc3m.es


A kernel update was patched for the problem, removing packet writing support.

[Ruslan]

Perhaps the drive won't work but a driver (which is software) WILL NOT cause damage to hardware unless it is a flashable bios upgrade or firmware upgrade.
It is like a virus.
A virus can do much damage, but it will not do any physical damage to a hard drive.
The same with drivers for CDRom drives.
Also, why do you need a driver for a CD drive in the first place???


Hot discussion, isn't it? ;)

Theoretically, everything what have flashable BIOS, can be destroyed...

1. All modern CDROM/RW/DVD drives are having flashable BIOS and can be upgraded. Using for flashing wrong or corrupted image file can destroy the drive... That's why almost any CDROM manufacturers are using "checking for compatiblity before flashing" method for preventing problems...
But if you can somehow disable that "checking" and force reflashing?...

2. All the modern harddrives are having flashable BIOS and thus, firmware can be updated/upgraded... rarely, but sometimes HDD manufacturers offers firmware updates for fixing some problems, for example, Fujitsu...

Personally I killed one Fujitsu MPG drive after that firmware update - firmware in the flash chip turned out be incompatible with firmware written on engineering servo zone (the harddrive was with already replaced electronics with partially incompatible BIOS, but I didn't know that).
Harddrive can die also, if something or someone will erase information in those engineering cylinders. Usually they are unavailable for end-users, but it is only for end-users...
By the way, erased servo-info is the most common problem with Fujitsu MPG drives (naturally,errors in firmware, made by Fujitsu programmers, causes firmware kills itself! :flame: )... and as result, many of dead Fujitsu drives can be fixed by simple re-writing back that firmware (downloaded from good drive - there are few special utils for that)... But that's another story... ;)

Anyway,if I killed the harddrive, why cannot someone (or something) else?......

3. Firmware on many hardware modems is also flashable - personally I did it many times... And I still remember years back were a lot of problems caused by failed reflashing firmware of external IDC 2814Plus modems (excellent modems, by the way)...

I'm not saying about the rest of hardware - most of modern hardware is firmware upgradable and as result, vulnerable to "errors"...

Regarding the Chernobyl virus - if I remember it correctly, this virus is more known under name Win95.CIH, attack only Win9X systems, and doesn't "work" for NT-based operation systems... That's why not so many people nowadays know about this very dangerous virus, erasing BIOS chips on MBs and first few thousands sectors on the harddrives...
Once again, some of notebook harddrives were having special hidden partition (Compaq mostly)... I have seen similar problem with an old Sharp NB also... Without that HDD refused to work (to boot) with NB it come from... Sometimes it is possible to fix by using Disk Manager utility...

That's all theory, but regarding the issue with Linux - I think it is just only coincidence - LG drives are known for having unreliable electonics...

[TripleRLtd]

Moved to linux forum....GEEZ, no wonder I couldn't find it when I PM'd Ruslan on this one.http://forums.windrivers.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif

[TripleRLtd]

Hot discussion, isn't it? ;)

Theoretically, everything what have flashable BIOS, can be destroyed...


Regarding the Chernobyl virus - if I remember it correctly, this virus is more known under name Win95.CIH, attack only Win9X systems, and doesn't "work" for NT-based operation systems... That's why not so many people nowadays know about this very dangerous virus, erasing BIOS chips on MBs and first few thousands sectors on the harddrives...
Once again, some of notebook harddrives were having special hidden partition (Compaq mostly)... I have seen similar problem with an old Sharp NB also... Without that HDD refused to work (to boot) with NB it come from... Sometimes it is possible to fix by using Disk Manager utility...

That's all theory, but regarding the issue with Linux - I think it is just only coincidence - LG drives are known for having unreliable electonics...Good point on the LG's, and we have discussed them before, but what about this that Doc said and why I wanted your opinion:
The drive was low-level formatted, checked sector-by sector, fdisked, etc.....keep in mind I have been messing with it for years. I think at one time I even sent it back to IBM with the response that it was not salvageable from the virus having damaged it, therefore no RMA.

As for the board, it is no longer worth anything....takes a max PII450. It's just a matter of tinkering now.

I replaced the the BIOS with 2 known working chips by hot-swapping them. The BIOS chips will work fine in other boards after I remove them from the "Chernobyl" one, but not in it. What do you think Rus?

[Ruslan]

Oh my god! :(
I didn't notice - it was an IBM drive and probably from IBM ThinkPad NB
:flame:

Then everything is clear for me - this drive is most likely having an IDE password on... Drive can be checked with no errors found, but you cannot write anything on it... Mentioned by me MHDD utility can disable that password, but the problem is - you have to know that original IDE password, which might be not related with BIOS password... I have similar (or even the same) IBM drive and the same problem - I don't know that password... :(

[TripleRLtd]

Doc?
Check in will ya!
This has been bothering me for weeks.
And now Ruslan is here.

[Ruslan]

I'm not sure what the motherboard he is talking about... may be it is MS-6119? ;)
If so, this MB takes almost any PIII Slot1 CPUs (after BIOS patching ;) ).
But it can be just hardware problem like popped capacitors or blown voltage regulator/or transistors...

[TripleRLtd]

I'm not sure what the motherboard he is talking about... may be it is MS-6119? ;)
If so, this MB takes almost any PIII Slot1 CPUs (after BIOS patching ;) ).
But it can be just hardware problem like popped capacitors or blown voltage regulator/or transistors...Too true, but he is Teh Doc, and know's his stuff enough to know that.
Right?
He is saying that since Chernobyl he can't get the board to work?
That is why I asked you here.
I find it hard to believe that a virus did that much damage.
I see it in the current/future, but not then.
I almost need to see coincidental hardware damage, not a virus causing hardware damage,
Know what I mean?

[TripleRLtd]

Listen Rus, the chatter's just told me teh Doc has passed out, so I would appreciate it if you could check this thread later this weekend, since we don't know how long his "lapse" will last.
And, without his input, we can not get anywhere.
Alright?
And, thanks for coming here.http://forums.windrivers.com/images/smilies/thumbs.gif

[FireAm94]

I wouldn't expect IBM to touch that drive with a 10 foot pole if evidence of a virus was there. That would be standard procedure however...they have MORE than enough returns to deal with without helping joe blow with his virus initiated problems! The drive itself wasn't damaged....just the software that controls the drive? Software can cause something else to damage your equipment or lack of proper software can cause your hardware to become "unusable/detectable" but IMO it cannot damage it. I think of monitors....refresh rate is set to high....BOOM...monitor is blown. The software didn't do it....it just allowed the change.....if ya see where i'm coming from.