Michael Moore's a Big, Fat Idiot!!!

[JaxSon]

Michael Moore film appeals to terrorists (http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=39012)

The Guardian of London reported today organizations related to the Middle East-based terrorist network have offered to help promote the film in the United Arab Emirates.

'Fahrenheit 9/11' serves one purpose and one purpose only: to undermine the United State's war against terrorism. This is precisely why Move America Forward has asked Americans to register their dissatisfaction with movie theaters that choose to show this film."

Concluded Kaloogian: "Now is the time for Americans to stand united behind the men and women fighting in Iraq and Afghanistan to preserve our safety and national security, not promote the agenda of radical terrorist organizations like Hezbollah."

Again, Moore's a Big, Fat Idiot!!!

[jaeger]

Ok Jaxson, cut it out now. I think you are a bit more reasonable than techs, but you are also almost as annoying. How about posting on the glory of bouncing boobies rather than politics?

[Stalemate]

I didn't see the poll. :confused:

[WebHead]

I'll be laughing when it's shown that nobody cares about this retarded poll.

[Ya_know]

I didn't see the poll. :confused:

I vote yes too!

[techs]

Wow. I didn't know that.
In fact your link is to the WorldNetDaily was very informative.
Here are some other things they have on their site:

Lawmakers afraid to oust 'marriage justices'?


Osama-Saddam links 9-11 commission missed

Kerry's sexy Mother Teresa Exclusive: Ilana Mercer on the 'succubus that shares his bed'

Using black America: The 'gay' lobby's turn

Jaxson you are a complete idiot. If you read things like this and believe them you are a stupid moron. Even stupider than Bush.

[Escape_Driver]

Hey agree or disagree he makes you think at least.. Thats more than you can say for 99.9% of the junk coming out of Hollywood

[Escape_Driver]

Techs .... Jaxson... Play nice !!!!

Don't force me to post boobie pics here !!!

[Ya_know]

I'll be laughing when it's shown that nobody cares about this retarded poll.

Moore is a liability to our national security...we should give him to the terrorists for a little lesson. Hopefully before the beheading he will have come to the conclusion that he was wrong for everything he ever did, and there is just enough time for a SF unit to bust him out so he can tell his story. And if there isn’t enough time, no loss.

[JaxSon]

Ok Jaxson, cut it out now. I think you are a bit more reasonable than techs, but you are also almost as annoying. How about posting on the glory of bouncing boobies rather than politics?

Yes, I know it can get annoying...but these things need to be said.

I saw that fat slob on the Today Show this morning and he is really starting to p*ss me off. He sits there on his fat *ss and makes it out that Bush is the real enemy...just like that punk techs.

They are both disgraceful Americans.

[techs]

For those who missed it:
http://forums.windrivers.com/showthread.php?t=59814

Does FoxNews love Fahrenheit 911?
I don't know who Roger Freidman the Fox news reviewer is but he seems to love Fahrenheit 911.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,122680,00.html

"It turns out to be a really brilliant piece of work, and a film that members of all political parties should see without fail."

"As much as some might try to marginalize this film as a screed against President George Bush, "F9/11" — as we saw last night — is a tribute to patriotism, to the American sense of duty — and at the same time a indictment of stupidity and avarice."

"Readers of this column may recall that I had a lot of problems with Moore's "Bowling for Columbine...
Not so with "F9/11," which instead relies on lots of film footage and actual interviews to make its case against the war in Iraq and tell the story of the intertwining histories of the Bush and bin Laden families"

"The most indelible is Bush's reaction to hearing on the morning of Sept. 11, 2001, that the first plane had crashed into the World Trade Center.
Bush was reading to a grade-school class in Florida at that moment. Instead of jumping up and leaving, he instead sat in front of the class, with an unfortunate look of confusion, for nearly 11 minutes.
Moore obtained the footage from a teacher at the school who videotaped the morning program. There Bush sits, with no access to his advisers, while New York is being viciously attacked. I guarantee you that no one who sees this film forgets this episode."

Looks like FoxNews loves F911, or at least their movie reviewer does.

[meatwad]

NooNoo, can you just throw these two out so we can get back to our dull happy lives. I'm seriously ready to just stop coming here at this point. With the day I'm having I could care less if the whole world just exploded at this point, and neither of these guys is helping. :eek2:

[Ya_know]

NooNoo, can you just throw these two out so we can get back to our dull happy lives. I'm seriously ready to just stop coming here at this point. With the day I'm having I could care less if the whole world just exploded at this point, and neither of these guys is helping. :eek2:

Don't let the door hit ya!

PS, see ya when you get back.

[Escape_Driver]

Is the only insult you can throw at him is that he is FAT???? And that he says things that you don't like.... Here’s the point he has the right to do this and make money off it and there is NOTHING wrong with it.... That’s called free speech and the moment you stop someone from voicing there opinion the terrorists have won!!!

[Escape_Driver]

NooNoo, can you just throw these two out so we can get back to our dull happy lives. I'm seriously ready to just stop coming here at this point. With the day I'm having I could care less if the whole world just exploded at this point, and neither of these guys is helping. :eek2:

just don't read it meat

[jaeger]

NooNoo, can you just throw these two out so we can get back to our dull happy lives. I'm seriously ready to just stop coming here at this point. With the day I'm having I could care less if the whole world just exploded at this point, and neither of these guys is helping. :eek2:

Uhm, the whole world IS supposed to explode tonight, didn't you hear? Comet debris cloud or somesuch. Woohoo, its the end of the world. Again.

[meatwad]

I'm back. But I'm still in a sh*tty mood. :p

[JaxSon]

Is the only insult you can throw at him is that he is FAT???? And that he says things that you don't like.... Here’s the point he has the right to do this and make money off it and there is NOTHING wrong with it.... That’s called free speech and the moment you stop someone from voicing there opinion the terrorists have won!!!

Did you not see that his movie appeals to the terrorists? Is that OK with U? Then, the terrorists (and that fatty, fat, fatso) have in fact won.

[Stalemate]

Hey agree or disagree he makes you think at least.. Thats more than you can say for 99.9% of the junk coming out of Hollywood


I thought his stuff was 99.9% of the junk coming out of Hollywood? :p

[Escape_Driver]

Did you not see that his movie appeals to the terrorists? Is that OK with U? Then, the terrorists have in fact won.

So no free speech ok that sounds good

[Stalemate]

Really, at the end of the day (and the week, in this case), does all this truly matter?

I mean, regardless of Moore's opinions, muslim terrorists still consider him an infidel along with the rest and would want nothing better than to eradicate him and his country from the face of the Earth.

[Escape_Driver]

Really, at the end of the day (and the week, in this case), does all this truly matter?

I mean, regardless of Moore's opinions, muslim terrorists still consider him an infidel along with the rest and would want nothing better than to eradicate him and his country from the face of the Earth.

Yep true !!!

[Cleetus]

And they don't like sluts nor porn stars

[meatwad]

Monkeys are silly.

[NooNoo]

It always bemuses me that people have to point up a personal attribute in order to try to discredit a person.

Tell me Jaxson, exactly how does Michael's weight relate to your opinion of his work?

[Larommi]

It always bemuses me that people have to point up a personal attribute in order to try to discredit a person.

Tell me Jaxson, exactly how does Michael's weight relate to your opinion of his work?

He was letting us know that Moore is fat. The part where he said idiot reflects on Moores work. :D I am guessing.

[Titchski]

Jaxson you are a complete idiot. If you read things like this and believe them you are a stupid moron. Even stupider than Bush.

Don't use my patented moron argument unless you a) ask me first, or b) use it in its full context:

Okay, here goes. The Democrats are a bunch of morons. Kerry (the Mass. Moron) is the appointed standard bearer of these morons.

The Republicans are also morons. Bush (the Moron from Texas) is the appointed standard bearer of these morons.

Neither of these bunch of morons want to change anything for the better. They just want power for themselves and their financial backers (campaign finance).

Thank you, it is now time for football.

[TechZ]

I wonder if Osama got to see Fahrenheit 9/11

[MobilePCPhysician]

Did you not see that his movie appeals to the terrorists? Is that OK with U? Then, the terrorists (and that fatty, fat, fatso) have in fact won.
Fatty, fatty, 2 by 4.
couldn't fit through the bathroom door,,,,,,,,,,,,,

Fatty, fat, fatso??? How old are you??http://forums.windrivers.com/images/smilies/sagrin.gif

[G Man]

Ok Jaxson, cut it out now. I think you are a bit more reasonable than techs, but you are also almost as annoying. How about posting on the glory of bouncing boobies rather than politics?

Ok, just lemme know where this particular thread "BOUNCING BOOBIES" is located so i can put it in my favourites, yes?

[GrandDad]

Ok, just lemme know where this particular thread "BOUNCING BOOBIES" is located so i can put it in my favourites, yes?
Just do a search here on 'boobie' or sim. . :grin:

[TechZ]

Michael Moore has the right to free expression, if he thinks Bush is bad, let him, many ppl do, its all good. Maybe someone could make a movie against his?

[FatalException0E]

Ok, just lemme know where this particular thread "BOUNCING BOOBIES" is located so i can put it in my favourites, yes?
Just wait for Friday. Thursdays are pretty nice, too. :thumbs:

[TechZ]

Thank god those arent sticky's

[paraflyer]

Michael Moore has the right to free expression, if he thinks Bush is bad, let him, many ppl do, its all good. Maybe someone could make a movie against his?

Already in the works....

http://www.michaelmoorehatesamerica.com/index.html

The biggest problem Morre has is the same problem Kerry has; both tout themselves as being "men of the people", and "for the common man", yet both make millions of dollars (OK, so Kerry gets it from his wife), and tend to $h!t on the "common man" they attempt to endear.

[TripleRLtd]

I found this interesting, coming from a self-acknowledged American liberal/left viewpoint:
Unfairenheit 9/11
The lies of Michael Moore.
By Christopher Hitchens
http://slate.msn.com/id/2102723/?GT1=3584

Beware: it's a long article.

[Ya_know]

I watched South Park the movie the other night, and this thread reminds me of a song...sing along if ya_know it!

Weeeeeeeeeeelllllllllllllllllll......Michael Moore is a big fat bitch, he's the bigest bitch in the whole wide world....

:devil: Honestly Saddam, you don't nurture my needs... :p Oh come on Satan, let's f*<k.

[ilovetheusers]

OMG - I look like Moore from the movie poster (except with a better hat and beard). I'm gonna go off and shoot myself.
http://forums.windrivers.com/images/smilies/sad2.gif


Now people are going to mistake me for him instead of Kevin Smith.
http://forums.windrivers.com/images/smilies/sad2.gif

[Ya_know]

I found this interesting, coming from a self-acknowledged American liberal/left viewpoint:
http://slate.msn.com/id/2102723/?GT1=3584

Beware: it's a long article.
That's actually a good article. Some of the beginning paragraph was bloated with some of that "let me impress you with how smart I sound" rhetoric, but once you blaze through that the rest is rather enjoyable... :cool:

I like this of several quotes: Indeed, Moore's affected and ostentatious concern for black America is one of the most suspect ingredients of his pitch package. In a recent interview, he yelled that if the hijacked civilians of 9/11 had been black, they would have fought back, unlike the stupid and presumably cowardly white men and women (and children). Never mind for now how many black passengers were on those planes—we happen to know what Moore does not care to mention: that Todd Beamer and a few of his co-passengers, shouting "Let's roll," rammed the hijackers with a trolley, fought them tooth and nail, and helped bring down a United Airlines plane, in Pennsylvania, that was speeding toward either the White House or the Capitol. There are no words for real, impromptu bravery like that, which helped save our republic from worse than actually befell. The Pennsylvania drama also reminds one of the self-evident fact that this war is not fought only "overseas" or in uniform, but is being brought to our cities. Yet Moore is a silly and shady man who does not recognize courage of any sort even when he sees it because he cannot summon it in himself. To him, easy applause, in front of credulous audiences, is everything.

And the closing remark was splendedid:
If Michael Moore had had his way, Slobodan Milosevic would still be the big man in a starved and tyrannical Serbia. Bosnia and Kosovo would have been cleansed and annexed. If Michael Moore had been listened to, Afghanistan would still be under Taliban rule, and Kuwait would have remained part of Iraq. And Iraq itself would still be the personal property of a psychopathic crime family, bargaining covertly with the slave state of North Korea for WMD. You might hope that a retrospective awareness of this kind would induce a little modesty. To the contrary, it is employed to pump air into one of the great sagging blimps of our sorry, mediocre, celeb-rotten culture. Rock the vote, indeed.

[Escape_Driver]

I want to see the movie before is pass judgement on it... Try seeing it first... Before you call it crap

[Ya_know]

I want to see the movie before is pass judgement on it... Try seeing it first... Before you call it crap

I absolutely agree...however one important thing I would like to note. If you do go see it, buy a ticket for a different movie, and sneek in to this one. I don't want him getting any more money than he already has!!!

[Stalemate]

I absolutely agree...however one important thing I would like to note. If you do go see it, buy a ticket for a different movie, and sneek in to this one. I don't want him getting any more money than he already has!!!

As a true socialist, Moore should not be interested in money anyhow. http://forums.windrivers.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

[Ya_know]

As a true socialist, Moore should not be interested in money anyhow. http://forums.windrivers.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

Oh, but a true socialist he is not! (what ever those are)

[Escape_Driver]

As a true socialist, Moore should not be interested in money anyhow. http://forums.windrivers.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

I don't remember him claiming to be a socialist ?? Media Whore maybe

[paraflyer]

"What you have to realize about Moore’s fans, and liberals in general, is that they view the world in terms of two classes: oppressors and the oppressed. Everyone in the world belongs in one of those two groups, and since they would never consider themselves oppressors they subscribe to the victim mentality. Michael Moore has brilliantly taken this staunch belief in victimhood and turned it into a goose that lays golden eggs by continually goading his critics into attacking him, then using that as evidence that he’s being “silenced,” thus creating a self-fulfilling prophesy. He’s the victim of wacko right-wing ideologues who want nothing more than to stifle anyone who dares to speak “the truth.” In regards to Fahrenheit 911 he first used this tactic by claiming that Disney balked at distributing the film because of its content, when the truth is that Moore was told a year ago that he would have to find alternate distribution. But his fans ate it up, and it helped solidify his placement as one of the left’s true martyrs."

www.moorewatch.com

[Escape_Driver]

So people don't like what he has to say and he makes money off that..... Well that sure sounds like american media to me... From Emmem to Elvis contivercy sells... I'm not saying that Moore is an angel... He just Makes $$$

[inferno_gn]

Hi there,

It's freedom of speech. If Bush doesn't like it, well, screw him. Welcome to the freedom that you say you're fighting for and you praise so much.

Ju Leon...

[jaeger]

Hi there,

It's freedom of speech. If Bush doesn't like it, well, screw him. Welcome to the freedom that you say you're fighting for and you praise so much.

Ju Leon...

Uhm, I don't believe anyone here is advocating we go out and silence him, or that we force the government to do the same. I think we are just using our freedom of speech to let it be known that we think the man is a douchebag (I wonder if that will make it past the censor?).

[TechZ]

he should provide the movie on p2p sites too, at least ppl will get to see it.

[JaxSon]

It always bemuses me that people have to point up a personal attribute in order to try to discredit a person.

Tell me Jaxson, exactly how does Michael's weight relate to your opinion of his work?

The title of this thread is a take-off on a book that came out a few years ago by Al Franken..."Rush Limbaugh is a Big, Fat Idiot." All the libs thought that was such a cute, funny title.

But I find it interesting that you see a need to comment on my "fat" remarks but no need to comment on the terrorists wanting all of the Middle East to see Moore's film to increase the hatred towards the U.S. Seems like we are more concerned with being politically correct than worrying about real problems.

Having said that tho, I apologize to the people that I offended and will refrain from making such comments in the future.

[ilovetheusers]

The title of this thread is a take-off on a book that came out a few years ago by Al Franken..."Rush Limbaugh is a Big, Fat Idiot." All the libs thought that was such a cute, funny title.

But I find it interesting that you see a need to comment on my "fat" remarks but no need to comment on the terrorists wanting all of the Middle East to see Moore's film to increase the hatred towards the U.S. Seems like we are more concerned with being politically correct than worrying about real problems.

Having said that tho, I apologize to the people that I offended and will refrain from making such comments in the future.


Just as an FYI - I'm 300 lbs and I'm not offended. He is a big fat idiot.

Well, more to the point he's actually very clever at passing himself off as a documentary maker that's presenting facts when in actuality he purposefuly leaves out facts and twists truths to his own advantage. In essence, he's a big fat LIAR, but that may be slightly twisting the truth slightly...

[Escape_Driver]

The title of this thread is a take-off on a book that came out a few years ago by Al Franken..."Rush Limbaugh is a Big, Fat Idiot." All the libs thought that was such a cute, funny title.

But I find it interesting that you see a need to comment on my "fat" remarks but no need to comment on the terrorists wanting all of the Middle East to see Moore's film to increase the hatred towards the U.S. Seems like we are more concerned with being politically correct than worrying about real problems.

Having said that tho, I apologize to the people that I offended and will refrain from making such comments in the future.

I think you have that exactly backwards... This film shows that not everyone in the USA is like Bush...

[Cleetus]

Just as an FYI - I'm 300 lbs and I'm not offended. He is a big fat idiot.

Well, more to the point he's actually very clever at passing himself off as a documentary maker that's presenting facts when in actuality he purposefuly leaves out facts and twists truths to his own advantage. In essence, he's a big fat LIAR, but that may be slightly twisting the truth slightly...
You mean he is just like Rush and most of the talk radio people from both sides of the coin?

[craigmodius]

Well, more to the point he's actually very clever at passing himself off as a documentary maker that's presenting facts when in actuality he purposefuly leaves out facts and twists truths to his own advantage. In essence, he's a big fat LIAR, but that may be slightly twisting the truth slightly...

Because the guy on the TV said it (http://www.michaelmoore.com/words/wackoattacko/) so it must be true. After all would Microsoft and a Arms Dealer lie to us? (MSNBC) :thumbs:

Nothing against you ILTU, but I get tired of hearing the MM is a liar argument. I own the Bowling for Columbine film and those who talk about how much of a liar he is or his views on everything have never seen the film. As is the case here, noone's seen F-9/11 and everyone's pre-judging it.

The greater argument of BFC is not that we should ban guns (MM is a card carrying member of the NRA). To me it was an illustration of how the American Media and News covers violence. It bleeds it leads.

Regardless of what side of the fence anyone's on with MM he's just one guy out there expressing his opinion, trying to make a difference. You don't like it make your own bloody film.

And hopefully everyone here will reserve judgment until after they've seen it.

/end rant ;)

[Jediab]

Mike Mooreon is a card carrying member of the NRA? Show a link to that proof. Frankly I think it is a crock of BS. And even for some god aweful reason he has a card, he sure as hell doesnt do anything with his membership except attempt to discredit the 2nd Amendment folks.

Plain and simple Mooreon is a liar. Why? Because he states that BFC was and is a documentry. The definition of documentry is to present a topic with facts without altering it for political reasons of even "spin". Sure his "documentries" are based on real facts and events. But so was Shindler's List and Saving Private Ryan. Both the holocost and D-Day happened, but did Spielberg ever once call his great projects documentries? No, I dont think he did.

If His Royal Dipsh*tness had stated his films are just that films, and did not call them documentries, then I dont think there would be as much of a problem then what there is now.

[inferno_gn]

Hi there,

Well, maybe do a movie that is totally opposite of Moore's movie, if that is possible. *lol*

Ju Leon...

[amcfreek]

who the f~~ is micheal moron anny way ? if hes talaban can't we just send him to cuba with the rest of the talaban? or maybe we should just kill him anny way . it should be freedom to kill big fat idiots who p/ZZ uz off instead of freespeach , kinda like rock paper sizors .. freedom to kill big fat idiots wins everytime ...

[TripleRLtd]

Hey freek. Welcome back to WD! I heard you're the wild card of the ...... The enforcer 'sort of speak"http://forums.windrivers.com/images/smilies/eek3.gif. So, how have you been man? Good, I hope! Catch us all up, huh? Do you come in peace?http://forums.windrivers.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[craigmodius]

Mike Mooreon is a card carrying member of the NRA? Show a link to that proof. Frankly I think it is a crock of BS. And even for some god aweful reason he has a card, he sure as hell doesnt do anything with his membership except attempt to discredit the 2nd Amendment folks.

In the film he shows his card right to Charlton Heston and tells him is a longtime NRA member. Here (http://www.michaelmoore.com/words/message/index.php?messageDate=2002-10-30) on his site he says he is a NRA Marksman Award Winner.

Again, nobody actually watches the film, just criticize without having seen it. Watch it sometime, I think you'd be suprised that it's not the rabid leftist propaganda that everyone makes it out to be. He just tries to convey common sense.

[TripleRLtd]

In the film he shows his card right to Charlton Heston and tells him is a longtime NRA member. Here (http://www.michaelmoore.com/words/message/index.php?messageDate=2002-10-30) on his site he says he is a NRA Marksman Award Winner.

Again, nobody actually watches the film, just criticize without having seen it. Watch it sometime, I think you'd be suprised that it's not the rabid leftist propaganda that everyone makes it out to be. He just tries to convey common sense.OMG Craig!!! You just revealed yourself as a "blind man's buff...".
Common sense??? Based on his other flicks?? BTW: that is all they are: flicks in the Matrix. Get real now! He is spouting his leftist rhetoric, just like the "right" does there's!! Go back in this thread and read the post I made attributed to one of your "left wing liberals", who saw the film.
That being said, I HAVE seen his other crap, and I didn't like it. Being trained as an Historian with an eye towards History, that crap was unsupported to say the least, and inconsequential, to say the truth. Unless, of course, you're a left leaning minion intent on spreading LIES!!!! http://forums.windrivers.com/images/smilies/sad2.gif

[Stalemate]

Moore and NRA. (http://www.bowlingfortruth.com/bowlingforcolumbine/scenes/moorenra.htm)


FYI.

[amcfreek]

I SAY WE JUST KILL HIM ANNY WAY..
hey somebody go over and email micheal moore and tell him we want the truth straight from his mothe , we want to have this on the w/d before we blow his brains out witha sawed off 410 double barrel with 44 magnums in it..

[craigmodius]

OMG Craig!!! You just revealed yourself as a "blind man's buff...".
Common sense??? Based on his other flicks?? BTW: that is all they are: flicks in the Matrix. Get real now! He is spouting his leftist rhetoric, just like the "right" does there's!! Go back in this thread and read the post I made attributed to one of your "left wing liberals", who saw the film.
That being said, I HAVE seen his other crap, and I didn't like it. Being trained as an Historian with an eye towards History, that crap was unsupported to say the least, and inconsequential, to say the truth. Unless, of course, you're a left leaning minion intent on spreading LIES!!!! http://forums.windrivers.com/images/smilies/sad2.gif

Don't know what you mean by the ''blind man'' part. If you're implying that I am blind to any other views, or blindly accept MM word as gospel, I would have to disagree. I'm simply arguing for people to see the film before criticizing.

As is the case with the 'post made attributed to one of your "left wing liberals" if you are refering to the msnbc article you posted I glanced at it, but am going to reserve judgment until after I see the film. In the film end of things I consider that article potential spoiler and will book mark it and read it after seeing the film :)

Adept~ thanks for that link, very informative. Personally I like how MM will do something like that to make his point.

After Columbine, I decided that I would run against Charlton Heston for the presidency of the NRA. If elected, my plan was to try to return the NRA to a gun safety organization, instead of its current agenda of gun fanaticism. The rules said that to run for president, you had to be a member for the past five years or buy a lifetime membership for $750. And that's what I did. But after a while I realized this endeavor was going to take too much time, so I decided to focus all my attention on the movie I was making.

His movies and his old TV show have other such stunts, that I admire, that he uses to make his point. Like the scene where he gets a gun for opening a bank account. Which everyone who hasn't seen the film claims is fake or staged. (But if you've seen the film the teller informs him that they have 500 guns in their vault)

I'm not advocating gun control of any form, I'm a firm believer in the second ammendment as necessary to our freedom. But at the same time I'd also like to know why America's gun violence is so high compared to other countries. The point of the BFC film.

I'm also a firm believer in freedom of speech, but someone who's going to attack a film they've never even seen, imho should excercise their freedom to be silent.

Adept~ for the record, as another stunt from Canada in the BFC film goes, do you keep your doors locked at your house? There is an interesting comparison between America and Canada and their attitudes toward guns and crime and the sociopolital reasoning behind those attitudes. In the BFC film he goes thru the streets of I think Toronto opening people's doors and then asking them why they don't keep them locked.

[amcfreek]

thiers a difference in atitudes between kanooks and yanks .. no fooling thier is ..

and down here in teh states we just kill criminals .. and infact right now in my home town we have at least 500 criminals at the bottom of our strip mine pit...
no reason to lock our doors unless we plan on getting arested for baiting criminals out of season..

[Stalemate]

...Adept~ thanks for that link, very informative. Personally I like how MM will do something like that to make his point.

After Columbine, I decided that I would run against Charlton Heston for the presidency of the NRA. If elected, my plan was to try to return the NRA to a gun safety organization, instead of its current agenda of gun fanaticism. The rules said that to run for president, you had to be a member for the past five years or buy a lifetime membership for $750. And that's what I did. But after a while I realized this endeavor was going to take too much time, so I decided to focus all my attention on the movie I was making.
His movies and his old TV show have other such stunts, that I admire, that he uses to make his point. Like the scene where he gets a gun for opening a bank account. Which everyone who hasn't seen the film claims is fake or staged. (But if you've seen the film the teller informs him that they have 500 guns in their vault)...

You forgot the second part of that quote. Here it is:

Too much time... Here Moore actually admits that he'd rather take pot shots and defame those he disagrees with in movies rather than actually make any real change. Perhaps the paycheck from making a movie vs. NRA president was more enticing to Moore than it was to Charlton Heston. Dave Kopel writes:
But Moore's connection to the NRA is bizarre; he told Tim Russert that he joined the group so that he could be elected its president and make it support gun control. This is aggrandized self-delusion, rather like Barbra Streisand announcing that she was becoming Catholic so that she could be elected Pope and make the Church support polygamy.



Distortion on Heston's record

Moore says that the NRA is responsible for gun crime despite vigorous and bold efforts by the organization and especially Charlton Heston while he served as president, to curtail gun violence. For instance - Heston was known for taking tough stances like the following:

If you're a felon out on the streets of Philadelphia today, I dare you to carry a gun," Heston warned. "Because if you do, you will go to prison. No plea bargain, no discussion. Just a cold, hard federal prison cell. So go ahead -- carry a gun on these streets. To quote my good friend Clint Eastwood, 'Make My Day'. (January 25, 1999)

But then again, Moore and his viewers may equally hate that approach. Others (myself included) love that kind of no nonsense "bring it on" type of threat when concerning violence when the subtext is that "because you will be punished if you dare". It all depends on whether you're one of those crazies who like to confront wickedness instead of appease it.

But opinions aside - Moore's representation of the NRA is dishonest at best.




...Adept~ for the record, as another stunt from Canada in the BFC film goes, do you keep your doors locked at your house? There is an interesting comparison between America and Canada and their attitudes toward guns and crime and the sociopolital reasoning behind those attitudes. In the BFC film he goes thru the streets of I think Toronto opening people's doors and then asking them why they don't keep them locked.

I keep my door locked at all times.

I don't know anyone here who doesn't.

[ilovetheusers]

You mean he is just like Rush and most of the talk radio people from both sides of the coin?

Rush isn't overweight anymore. Maybe all the oxycottin cut his appetite.

Because the guy on the TV said it (http://www.michaelmoore.com/words/wackoattacko/) so it must be true. After all would Microsoft and a Arms Dealer lie to us? (MSNBC) :thumbs:

Nothing against you ILTU, but I get tired of hearing the MM is a liar argument. I own the Bowling for Columbine film and those who talk about how much of a liar he is or his views on everything have never seen the film. As is the case here, noone's seen F-9/11 and everyone's pre-judging it.

The greater argument of BFC is not that we should ban guns (MM is a card carrying member of the NRA). To me it was an illustration of how the American Media and News covers violence. It bleeds it leads.

Regardless of what side of the fence anyone's on with MM he's just one guy out there expressing his opinion, trying to make a difference. You don't like it make your own bloody film.

And hopefully everyone here will reserve judgment until after they've seen it.

/end rant ;)


I do reserve judgment and I have see columbine, roger and me and I even tried to watch his awful series on Comedy Central.

You obviously didn't read Tripples link http://slate.msn.com/id/2102723/?GT1=3584 which denotes how mikes film is BS per one who saw it and was actually knowledgeable beyond the nightly news on channel 3. From what he writes I can assume that Moore is again painting a bull**** picture of how things really are/were and people like you just lap it up. It’s just as bad a relying on Limbaugh or Hannity for all of your news exclusively.

As for Columbine, here's the dirt: http://www.hardylaw.net/Truth_About_Bowling.html
Beyond the fact that Moore uses statements and video out of context and strung together in a way meant to deceive the audience into believing something that is not factual, here’s my other opinion of the film:

I saw it as an asinine film that tried to tie a ton of liberal viewpoints together to make people feel better about them selves because it seemingly validates those asinine viewpoints. Oh, guns killed that poor little girl because her mommy couldn't get welfare and stay home instead of working and had to live with uncle jeb who had handguns laying out... Well, guess what. Accidents happen, it's awful and there is nothing you can do. Trying to blame a horrible accident on cutting welfare is beyond stupid.

Also, in columbine, I took offense that as a white man I must have bought a pistol because I was afraid of black people in the inner cities. Uh huh, right. Tell me more Mr. Moore about how I suck because of my race. Moore is nothing more than a reverse racist and I do not own nor do I know very many people who own guns.

As for his anti gun mission 0- that WAS the whole point of the film. He totally missed and then contradicted his whole point about the media in Columbine!!! Yes, our media sucks. That was a great point but he only used that to back up his anti gun rhetoric.




Now - what will you say when this film comes out? http://www.michaelmoorehatesamerica.com/index.html I can't wait for it.

[craigmodius]

I saw it as an asinine film that tried to tie a ton of liberal viewpoints together to make people feel better about them selves because it seemingly validates those asinine viewpoints. Oh, guns killed that poor little girl because her mommy couldn't get welfare and stay home instead of working and had to live with uncle jeb who had handguns laying out... Well, guess what. Accidents happen, it's awful and there is nothing you can do. Trying to blame a horrible accident on cutting welfare is beyond stupid.

Also, in columbine, I took offense that as a white man I must have bought a pistol because I was afraid of black people in the inner cities. Uh huh, right. Tell me more Mr. Moore about how I suck because of my race. Moore is nothing more than a reverse racist and I do not own nor do I know very many people who own guns.

As for his anti gun mission 0- that WAS the whole point of the film. He totally missed and then contradicted his whole point about the media in Columbine!!! Yes, our media sucks. That was a great point but he only used that to back up his anti gun rhetoric.




Now - what will you say when this film comes out? http://www.michaelmoorehatesamerica.com/index.html I can't wait for it.

OK, now we're getting somewhere, people who've actually seen the film.

That is a good point about him trying to tie together a bunch of liberal viewpoints. I can respect your interpretation.

IMHO I saw it as him trying to give the whole story as to why that certain tragedy happened. To me these things like columbine, and that child shooting a classmate, happen and everyone throws their hands up in despair and bemoans the tragedy, but nobody ever attempts to disect why things like that happen. Which is why I respect the BFC film.

As for moore trying to make anyone feel guilty of being white, that's not my interpretation. I took it as him pointing out how the news media is trying to sell fear, and that fear is often packaged as a single black male.

I'm not reading any articles on F9/11 till after I see the movie because I would consider them spoilers. A local theater is running that and supersize me, so I'm going to try a double feature.

Adept~ your link about Moore and the NRA is IMHO misleading. The author seems to imply that moore joined the NRA after columbine as a stunt. However, the screencap of his marksman award on that link is cropped to not show the full date which is in fact July 21, 1971. If you watch the film they show the full picture of that award. So it seems to me that that author is using the same misleading tactics moore is chastised for.

[techs]

I am looking forward to seeing the reports being prepared about the Bush and Saudi relationship on network tv. Apparently so many people are shocked at how the Bushes are basically ONLY in business with the Saudi royals-they have no other business ventures at all. The Saudi royals are the most corrupt and hated people in the mid east.
btw don't you think it should be illegal for foreigners to contribute tens of millions of dollars to the Bush campaign. Aren't you concerned that almost all of it is from Saudi Arabia?

AND despite the movies having been seen by millions there is no one making the claim that any of the FACTS are untrue. They are claiming bias. Of course its biased. So is FoxNews. But on the occasions FoxNews gets their facts right no one critizies them. Yet, Moore who made a MOVIE is being treated like a news outlet and FoxNews which is equally biased IS a news outlet treated like a movie maker.

[Stalemate]

...Adept~ your link about Moore and the NRA is IMHO misleading. The author seems to imply that moore joined the NRA after columbine as a stunt. However, the screencap of his marksman award on that link is cropped to not show the full date which is in fact July 21, 1971. If you watch the film they show the full picture of that award. So it seems to me that that author is using the same misleading tactics moore is chastised for.

Was it also misleading when you agreed with the partial quote you posted? ;)


...Adept~ thanks for that link, very informative. Personally I like how MM will do something like that to make his point...

Just to conclude my interest in this thread, I didn't write the comments in the first place. I just found them while trying to find background info on Moore's NRA membership.

[JaxSon]

From MSNBC:
Michael Moore In his own words. (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5353971/)

“The Iraqis who have risen up against the occupation are not ‘insurgents’ or ‘terrorists’ or ‘The Enemy.’ They are the REVOLUTION, the Minutemen, and their numbers will grow - and they will win.” - MichaelMoore.com, April 24

“The motivation for war is simple. The U.S. government started the war with Iraq in order to make it easy for U.S. corporations to do business in other countries. They intend to use cheap labor in those countries, which will make Americans rich.”

“They are possibly the dumbest people on the planet ... in thrall to conniving, thieving smug [pieces of the human anatomy],” Moore intoned. “We Americans suffer from an enforced ignorance. We don’t know about anything that’s happening outside our country. Our stupidity is embarrassing.”

“You’re [the British] stuck with being connected to this country of mine, which is known for bringing sadness and misery to places around the globe.”

“We, the United States of America, are culpable in committing so many acts of terror and bloodshed that we had better get a clue about the culture of violence in which we have been active participants.”

“Should such an ignorant people lead the world?”

“Don’t go the American way when it comes to economics, jobs and services for the poor and immigrants. It is the wrong way.”

This guy is so ANTI-American it's not even funny. It fact, it's embarrassing! And yet, the democrats want to put this guy up on a pedistal and worship every thing he says and does.

[Cleetus]

Honestly, which is more Anti-American, talking out against your country or denying someone the right to talk out against the woes you find in your country?

I'll call the latter more Anti-American any day of the week.

[Escape_Driver]

This is what kills me .... He has the right to say what he wants... I you don't like it don't listen... Why is that so hard for people to understand ??

[JaxSon]

Of course he has the right to say anything he wants. But for people to actually believe it is what blows me away.

Nobody is trying to keep him from talking. I'm just trying to offset his anti-American bias.

Again, from MSNBC:
"Fahrenheit 9/11" distorts the truth; Deceit and deception is breathtaking (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5296236/)
Though I'd need four hours to tell you the list of all the falsehoods from Moore's two-hour movie, let me give you a few glimpses into his twisted logic:

Moore's movie begins by pitching his conspiracy theory about the 2000 election. We're all told in the audience by all recounting methods Al Gore won Florida. That drew a big gasp from the crowd. But, shockingly, this first fact cited by Moore's movie is a lie. Didn't anybody associated with Miramax or Michael Moore's movie read newspapers after the election, when some of America's most liberal papers published results from their independent review of Florida's ballots, concluding it was George W. Bush who won by all recounting methods?

Now, there are hundreds of conspiracy theories that are simply unsupported by the facts. But Moore goes on to show pictures of dead Iraqi babies, followed immediately by American soldiers talking about the rush they got listening to rock C.D.s while they shot at anything they moved in Iraq. Why didn't Moore just write "baby killers" on the screen and point to U.S. troops?

I guess I shouldn't be surprised that Michael Moore would make this kind of movie, but I am stunned that movie critics, Hollywood moguls and liberal movie viewers across America really think so little of America, its soldiers and its leaders.

[paraflyer]

btw don't you think it should be illegal for foreigners to contribute tens of millions of dollars to the Bush campaign.

Funny, I don't recall a big outcry on your part when Klinton kept getting $$ in exchange for nuclear technology from his Chinese friends

[Escape_Driver]

Of course he has the right to say anything he wants. But for people to actually believe it is what blows me away.

Nobody is trying to keep him from talking. I'm just trying to offset his anti-American bias.

Again, from MSNBC:
"Fahrenheit 9/11" distorts the truth; Deceit and deception is breathtaking (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5296236/)


The fact that people believe Bush blows me away.... And the rest of the world

[TechZ]

Funny, I don't recall a big outcry on your part when Klinton kept getting $$ in exchange for nuclear technology from his Chinese friends
because they have their own agendas,Right?

What about all the corporate contributions that later on are cashed in?

[Orangeman]

This thread is at least two weeks old!
I thought it was dead. Why was it revived?
Do you get a hard-on over Michael Moore...

[Ya_know]

This thread is at least two weeks old!
I thought it was dead. Why was it revived?
Do you get a hard-on over Michael Moore...

You're the dumba$$ that brought back the Bush senior skydiving thread which was like a month old, and said you wanted him to break his neck. You are such a hardhead...

[Ya_know]

Here it is, post #7 George Bush (http://forums.windrivers.com/showthread.php?t=59545&highlight=George+Bush)

[paraflyer]

OK, how 'bout we send Moore on a skydiving jaunt....














....sans parachute.

Let's see if he makes a "big, fat crater". :devil:

[jitBob]

OK, how 'bout we send Moore on a skydiving jaunt....

....sans parachute.
Let it go. Your blood pressure will thank you.

[Ya_know]

Let it go. Your blood pressure will thank you.

I was going to say the same to you, my balls will thank you... :eek2:

[Escape_Driver]

OK, how 'bout we send Moore on a skydiving jaunt....














....sans parachute.

Let's see if he makes a "big, fat crater". :devil:

Have you seen the movie ???

[paraflyer]

Have you seen the movie ???

Movie or not, I still wouldn't want to be near the impact zone.

[Escape_Driver]

Movie or not, I still wouldn't want to be near the impact zone.

So you are judging a man by his work which you have not seen ???

[Escape_Driver]

Or are you saying that because of his size he couldn't do good work ?

[Orangeman]

You're the dumba$$ that brought back the Bush senior skydiving thread which was like a month old, and said you wanted him to break his neck. You are such a hardhead...

coming from an a$$hole (and a retard) that remark really hurts.... :devil:

[paraflyer]

BUMP.


Or are you saying that because of his size he couldn't do good work ?

No, I'm saying that someone who lies deliberately to sell his film couldn't do good work.

Example below:

"At the end of the film Bush says "Fool me once, shame on… me. I won't get fooled again." Clearly that moment demands that we hear Roger Daltrey scream, "Won't get fooled again!" That's how I had it cut. Pete Townsend blocked it, would not allow the song to be used. Word came to us that he is not a fan of Michael Moore's and in fact supports the war and supports Tony Blair and doesn't want the song used in any way that would make Blair look bad. "

Interview with Moore, http://www.filmlinc.com/fcm/online/fahr911interview.htm

"I had not really been convinced by BOWLING FOR COLUMBINE, and had been worried about its accuracy; it felt to me like a bullying film. Out of courtesy to Harvey I suggested that if he and Moore were determined to have me reconsider, I should at least get a chance to see a copy of the new film. I knew that with Cannes on the horizon, time was running short for them, and this might not be possible. I never received a copy of the film to view. At no time did I ask Moore or Miramax to reconsider anything. Once I had an idea what the film was about I was 90% certain my song was not right for them."

http://www.petetownshend.co.uk/diary/display.cfm?id=89&zone=diary

As for Moore's size, I'm just afraid of the size of the impact crater.

[imaeditedbysowulo]

Isn't Pete Townshend the same guy that was arrested for kiddy porn a year or two again and then said he was just doing research about it?

[NooNoo]

yup (http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/petetownshend1.html)

[paraflyer]

Still, made for an interesting conflict of stories....

[Escape_Driver]

Isn't Pete Townshend the same guy that was arrested for kiddy porn a year or two again and then said he was just doing research about it?

Wow a pedofile doesn't like Moore.... Well I guess we shouldn't watch Moore's movie then...

[paraflyer]

Isn't it amazing how we can resurrect old threads? :p

[imaeditedbysowulo]

Wow a pedofile doesn't like Moore.... Well I guess we shouldn't watch Moore's movie then...


My point was that anything a pedophile has to say has absolutely no influence on me. In my eyes a pedophile has no credibility. It hasn't been proven in a court of law that he's a pedophile, but I believe he is one.

I think anyone that wishes to discuss Moore's movie should go see it. Knowledge is power.

[Ya_know]

Wow a pedofile doesn't like Moore.... Well I guess we shouldn't watch Moore's movie then...

You're right! I need to rethink my political position...He supports the war too!!! :D

[Escape_Driver]

I've seen the movie... He does raise some valid points... However I do have to say that he did so in and incendiary manner..

[drewmaztech]

I just saw the movie last weekend. I have to admit it was a bit of an eye-opener but I also went into it expecting a "slightly tilted" point of view. (feel the sarcasm)

Generally I liked the movie and it was interesting to hear his point of view, but he's a bit of a conspiracy-theorist type guy.

Keep in mind he represents the EXTREME left, and not all liberals are that obsessed.

[paraflyer]

Keep in mind he represents the EXTREME left, and not all liberals are that obsessed.

You certain of that? :devil:

[TechZ]

Teh movie came out in the Gulf on Wednesday, with a a G Rating and nothings been cut out, I'm a bit busy preparing for Finals (2nd year) or I'd see it. Maybe I'll download it, I DO HAVE Permission from Mike Moore himself ;)

[JaxSon]

The point is that Pete Townsend still had rights over his/their song. And, they have to get permission to use it. He was under no obligation to do so.

OK, so the guy used his credit card for "research." Yeah, like I ever give out my credit card to anybody for anything...much less to some shady website on the 'net.

And no, I still haven't seen the movie yet. Since Moore's stated purpose is to defeat Bush in November...which is in direct conflict with what my goal is...there is no way I'm going to give him my hard earned money so that he can forward his cause. Sorry, ain't gonna happen.

[Escape_Driver]

The point is that Pete Townsend still had rights over his/their song. And, they have to get permission to use it. He was under no obligation to do so.

OK, so the guy used his credit card for "research." Yeah, like I ever give out my credit card to anybody for anything...much less to some shady website on the 'net.

And no, I still haven't seen the movie yet. Since Moore's stated purpose is to defeat Bush in November...which is in direct conflict with what my goal is...there is no way I'm going to give him my hard earned money so that he can forward his cause. Sorry, ain't gonna happen.

Then don't try and coment on something you haven't seen

[Jediab]

The don't try and coment on something you haven't seen

Jax and anyone for that matter can comment on anything they want to. You do it, I do it, we all do it. So get over yourself.

[JaxSon]

Retired general disputes Michael Moore's account of President Bush’s actions on Sept. 11 (http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,125860,00.html)

There is a scene in Michael Moore's (search) new film that shows President Bush at the moment he was told the U.S. was under attack. As the camera focuses in on an obviously anguished president, Mr. Moore provides his own commentary of what he thinks President Bush was thinking at the time.

But Mr. Moore’s musings must now be juxtaposed with the account of retired Lt. General Thomas Keck, who spent two hours with President Bush on that fateful day. Gen. Keck wrote to The New York Times, whose columnist Paul Krugman had praised Moore for his make-believe account.

Says Gen. Keck: “As commander of the 8th Air Force, I was present when President Bush stopped to deliver a message to the American people at Barksdale Air Force Base. Throughout my career, I have seen the best and the worst of people under extreme pressure. President Bush arrived at Barksdale deeply saddened and obviously concerned, but he was a man on a mission, courageous and decisive. He was totally in command. I have kept relatively quiet about my experiences with the president on 9/11, but I cannot sit back and allow Hollywood and the media to rewrite history. I was there, and I consider myself a good judge of leadership. We were fortunate that President Bush was our commander in chief on 9/11.”

[Escape_Driver]

Retired general disputes Michael Moore's account of President Bush’s actions on Sept. 11 (http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,125860,00.html)

As the camera focuses in on an obviously anguished president ????

Not what I saw.... He didn't understand what was happening... But he is not to blame for the time spent reading with the kids.... The secret service should have grabbed him by his face and thrown him in a limo and got him the hell out of there... Thats their job !!! and they failed completely in it.

[Escape_Driver]

To be honest I don't think anyone could have not been a little dazed by the info..

[JaxSon]

There is a scene in Michael Moore's (search) new film that shows President Bush at the moment he was told the U.S. was under attack. As the camera focuses in on an obviously anguished president, Mr. Moore provides his own commentary of what he thinks President Bush was thinking at the time.

Hey E-D, since you saw the movie, what does Moore say Bush is thinking?

[techs]

I haven't yet seen it but he was probably wondering if he was wearing clean underwear.

[JaxSon]

Still waiting on an intelligent reply.

Seriously, I was wondering if Moore was being serious and convey a valid point or was he trying to be funny by being a smart*ss.

Just curious...

[techs]

I don't know what Moore says Bush may be thinking. But if Bush is thinking about anything other than the fact he is Commander in Chief and should be rushing out of there to take charge than he doesn't deserve to be Commander in Chief.

[Escape_Driver]

I think Moore wrongly says Bush could not make up his mind...

[craigmodius]

Hey E-D, since you saw the movie, what does Moore say Bush is thinking?

He says some things about wondering what Geogre Bush is thinking...

“Maybe Mr. Bush was wondering why he had cut terrorism funding from the FBI.”

“This question of resources will also come up in the commission's questioning of Attorney General John Ashcroft, who was brand-new on the job in the fall of 2001 and on September 10th cut the FBI's request for new counterterrorism money by 12 percent.” John Dimsdale, “Former FBI Director Louis Freeh and Attorney General John Ashcroft to appear before 9/11 commission tomorrow,” NPR Radio: Marketplace, April 12, 2004. See also, 2001 budget documents including Attorney General John Ashcroft FY 2003 budget request to Office of Management and Budget, September 10, 2001, showing $65 million offset in the FBI budget for counter-terrorism equipment grants: http://www.americanprogress.org/atf/cf/%7BE9245FE4-9A2B-43C7-A521-5D6FF2E06E03%7D/FY03ASHCROFT.PDF


“Was it the guy my daddy’s friends delivered a lot of weapons to?”

In 1995, a member of Reagan's National Security Council and co-author of his National Security Directives, Howard Teicher, signed a sworn affidavit stating: “From early 1982 to 1987, I served as a Staff Member to the United States National Security Council.… In June, 1982, President Reagan decided that the United States could not afford to allow Iraq to lose the war to Iran. President Reagan decided that the United States would do whatever was necessary and legal to prevent Iraq from losing the war with Iran. Pursuant to the secret NSDD, the United States actively supported the Iraqi war effort by supplying the Iraqis with billions of dollars of credits, by providing U.S. military intelligence and advice to the Iraqis, and by closely monitoring third country arms sales to Iraq to make sure that Iraq had the military weaponry required. This message was delivered by Vice President Bush who communicated it to Egyptian President Mubarak, who in turn passed the message to Saddam Hussein. Under CIA Director Casey and Deputy Director Gates, the CIA made sure that non-U.S. manufacturers manufactured and sold to Iraq the weapons needed by Iraq. In certain instances where a key component in a weapon was not readily available, the highest levels of the United States government decided to make the component available, directly or indirectly, to Iraq. I specifically recall that the provision of anti-armor penetrators to Iraq was a case in point. The United States made a policy decision to supply penetrators to Iraq." Affidavit of former Howard Teicher, UNITED STATES OF AMERICA v. CARLOS CARDOEN et al, January 31, 1995. http://www.information*************.info/article1413.htm

“Questions have been raised about whether the United States not only ignored foreign arms shipments to Iraq, but actually encouraged or even arranged them. A former National Security Council official, Howard Teicher, said in a 1995 court affidavit that the CIA made sure Iraq received weapons from non-U.S. manufacturers.” Ken Guggenheim, “War Crimes Trial for Saddam Could Reveal Details of Past U.S. Help,” Associated Press, January 24, 2004.
“There is ample documentation demonstrating that the Reagan and Bush administrations supplied critical military technologies that were put directly to use in the construction of the Iraqi war machine. There is also strong evidence indicating that the executive branch's failure to crack down on illegal weapons traffickers or keep track of third party transfers of U.S. weaponry allowed a substantial flow of U.S.-origin military equipment and military components to make their way to Iraq.” William D. Hartung, Weapons at War; A World Policy Institute Issue Brief, May 1995. See also, Alan Friedman, Spider's Web: The Secret History of How the White House Illegally Armed Iraq, (Bantam Books, 1993); Kenneth R. Timmerman, The Death Lobby: How the West Armed Iraq, (Houghton, Mifflin, 1991).
“Rep. Dante Fascell, D-Fla., chairman of the House Foreign Affairs Committee, said … that the United States could not ‘make a claim for purity’ on arms sales, since the U.S. government has sold weapons to Iran, Iraq ‘and everybody else in the world.’” Robert Shepard, “Congress Approves Aid for Former Soviet Republics,” United Press International, October 3, 1992.
“A covert American program during the Reagan administration provided Iraq with critical battle planning assistance at a time when American intelligence agencies knew that Iraqi commanders would employ chemical weapons in waging the decisive battles of the Iran-Iraq war, according to senior military officers with direct knowledge of the program. Those officers, most of whom agreed to speak on the condition that they not be identified, spoke in response to a reporter's questions about the nature of gas warfare on both sides of the conflict between Iran and Iraq from 1981 to 1988. Iraq's use of gas in that conflict is repeatedly cited by President Bush and, this week, by his national security adviser, Condoleezza Rice, as justification for "regime change" in Iraq. The covert program was carried out at a time when President Reagan's top aides, including Secretary of State George P. Shultz, Defense Secretary Frank C. Carlucci and Gen. Colin L. Powell, then the national security adviser, were publicly condemning Iraq for its use of poison gas, especially after Iraq attacked Kurds in Halabja in March 1988.” Patrick E. Tyler, “Officers Say U.S. Aided Iraq in War Despite Use of Gas,” The New York Times, August 18, 2002.

“Was it that group of religious fundamentalists who visited my state when I was governor?”

“A senior delegation from the Taleban movement in Afghanistan is in the United States for talks with an international energy company that wants to construct a gas pipeline from Turkmenistan across Afghanistan to Pakistan. A spokesman for the company, Unocal, said the Taleban were expected to spend several days at the company's headquarters in Sugarland, Texas.” “Taleban in Texas for talks on Gas Pipeline,” BBC News, December 4, 1997 (Sugarland is 22 miles outside Houston.)

“Or was it the Saudis? Damn, it was them.”

“The 27 classified pages of a congressional report about Sept. 11 depict a Saudi government that not only provided significant money and aid to the suicide hijackers but also allowed potentially hundreds of millions of dollars to flow to Al Qaeda and other terrorist groups through suspect charities and other fronts, according to sources familiar with the document. One U.S. official who has read the classified section said it describes ‘very direct, very specific links’ between Saudi officials, two of the San Diego-based hijackers and other potential co-conspirators ‘that cannot be passed off as rogue, isolated or coincidental.’” Of all the hijackers, 15 of the 19 were Saudi. Josh Meyer, “Report Links Saudi Government to 9/11 Hijackers, Sources Say,” Los Angeles Times, August 2, 2003.


You should really go see the movie :thumbs:

[techs]

I think Moore wrongly says Bush could not make up his mind...
Wrongly? As in he DECIDED not to do anything?

[craigmodius]

And if I remember correctly he says about he wonders if Bush was thinking that he should have read

The security briefing that was given to him on August 6, 2001, said that Osama bin Laden was planning to attack America by hijacking airplanes.

August 6, 2001 Presidential Daily Brief (PDB): “Al-Qa'ida members -- including some who are US citizens -- have resided in or traveled to the US for years, and the group apparently maintains a support structure that could aid attacks. Two al-Qa'ida members found guilty in the conspiracy to bomb our Embassies in East Africa were US citizens, and a senior EIJ member lived in California in the mid-1990s. A clandestine source said in 1998 that a Bin Ladin cell in New York was recruiting Muslim-American youth for attacks. We have not been able to corroborate some of the more sensational threat reporting, such as that from a ... (redacted portion) ... service in 1998 saying that Bin Ladin wanted to hijack a US aircraft to gain the release of ‘Blind Shaykh’ 'Umar 'Abd al-Rahman and other US-held extremists. Nevertheless, FBI information since that time indicates patterns of suspicious activity in this country consistent with preparations for hijackings or other types of attacks, including recent surveillance of federal buildings in New York.” August 6, 2001, Bin Ladin Determined to Strike Inside US, http://www.cnn.com/2004/images/04/10/whitehouse.pdf
“The Aug. 6, 2001, document, known as the President's Daily Brief, has been the focus of intense scrutiny because it reported that bin Laden advocated airplane hijackings, that al-Qaida supporters were in the United States and that the group was planning attacks here.” Clarke J. Scott, “Clarke Gave Warning on Sept. 4, 2001; Testimony Includes Apology to Families of Sept. 11 Victims, Associated Press, March 25, 2004.

[Escape_Driver]

Wrongly? As in he DECIDED not to do anything?

No I don't like Bush but I think he was thinking if the attacks are bad they'll get me out of here ...

The Secret Service Failed here.... Not Bush he took care of fu(king things up later.

[silencio]

More from the Moore Front:

http://www.accessatlanta.com/hp/content/shared-gen/ap/Movies/Moore_Newspaper.html;COXnetJSessionID=BOPACYiAhWaq u29fHvD0Ws2Q4AOOAqXBnRqbLORVFue5jV1DoVOd!-1710468005?urac=n&urvf=10914897281130.41180861945235636

Newspaper Claims Moore Altered Front Page

http://img.coxnewsweb.com/B/00/57/01/image_801570.jpg
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(http://www.accessatlanta.com/hp/content/shared-gen/ap/Movies/Moore_Newspaper-image.html)Michael Moore, left, director of 'Fahrenheit 9/11,' and 'The Tonight Show' host Jay Leno sing during the taping of the show Thursday, July 29, 2004, in Burbank, Calif. Moore and Leno discussed the impact and success of the film before being encouraged to sing 'America the Beautiful,' during which the studio audience stood up and joined in the singing. (AP Photo/Paul Drinkwater, NBC)

BLOOMINGTON, Ill. — Filmmaker Michael Moore's Bush-bashing documentary "Fahrenheit 9/11" has apparently upset more than Republicans. The Pantagraph newspaper in Bloomington said Friday it sent a letter to Moore and the film's distributor, Lions Gate Entertainment Corp., asking for an apology for using what it said was a doctored front page in his movie.

The paper is seeking $1 in damages.

A scene early in the movie shows newspaper headlines related to the contested 2000 presidential election. It includes a shot of The Pantagraph's Dec. 19, 2001, front page, with the prominent headline, "Latest Florida recount shows Gore won election."

The newspaper says that headline never appeared on that day.

The paper said the headline appeared in a Dec. 5, 2001, edition but was not used on the front page. Instead, it was found in much smaller type above a letter to the editor, which the paper says reflects "only the opinions of the letter writer."

"If (Moore) wants to 'edit' The Pantagraph, he should apply for a copy-editing job," the paper said.

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Boy is Moore stupid. There were hundreds of different newspapers with that exact headline. He had to go and phony one up. I guess he just wanted to get sued. The NY Post or the NY Daily News had one just like it. In fact the NY Times did. I guess Moore really wanted an authoritative source like The Pantagraph- Serving Central Illinois.
When a news story just sound make sense I dismiss it. And AccessAtlanta? The height of responsible newsmedia. Didn't they say Pauly Shore was going to be the next James Bond?

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LOL! Yep, shoot the messenger. AccessAtlanta can't possbily measure up to your lofty heights of jounalistic responsibility. I imagine that also goes for both the AJC (who reprinted it) and the AP (who reported it).

You'd make a great racehorse techs. Your blinders are built in. ...but, i'll remove my head from the wall now.