Are you certified????

[jaimez]

Just curious as to how many tech's out there are A+ or MCSE certified. I got my training through an appenticeship, in other words I trained myself. Sure I screwed up a few times, but no more than any certified tech I've ever worked with.

It would be different if there was a course out there that actually showed you how to fix a computer.

What bugs me is that large corporations won't even look at you unless you are at least A+ certified and they don't even run a test to see if you can actually fix a computer problem or not.

I am currently waiting to do my A+ exam against my will, but for double my salary.

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It's not rocket science, it's just a computer.

[Snommis69]

Nope...don't have cert 1. I am entirely self taught. Not to put anyone down, but we have some certified guys who are literally clueless. I think that if someone genuinely loves what they do, they learn more and are better at it than any cert could lead to.
I feel for ya when you say many places won't look at ya without it, tho. Kinda funny, since this industry grew from geeks like us...

Damn the man!

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Is the damn thing plugged in, is the damn thing turned on?

[Darren Wilson]

I don't have any Certification at all!!!! Simply just cannot afford to spend money on a piece of paper at the moment. I know people who have MCSE's and such, and yet they still phone me up at home asking about a problem that they cannot solve at the office!! You cannot beat Hands-On experience. I wouldn't want a Builder who has just finished his exams in college to do any work on my house just because he scored the top of his class. I would employ someone who has been around for a bit and has the nessecary references to do the work in question, regardless of bits of paper he may not have. Same if I had my own business. I would put a broken system in front of the person and say fix it. If they could fix it in a certain period of time to my satisfaction then I would give them a try-out, regardless of certification. I have a friend who is an IT Trainer by living, who teaches people how to use MS Office, etc, yet I get him calling me up as well asking how to change a simple setting in the software. He can open up Word and types a letter, save it, then print it, but that is it!!!! He has certifications coming out of his ears and he can't solve a simple problem. He asks me to go round to his house to install a piece of software that he has just bought, as he is scared that he may mess up his system by installing it!!!! Would you want to be taught by this bloke???? On paper he is the business, but in reality he can't do anything really! Sorry but a hands-on tech will always be held higher in my eyes than a paper tech. Not trying to upset you Techs out there who do a good job and have the certification, but I have seen too many Paper Techs to last me a lifetime.

I don't see why a Tech who has certifications can demand a higher salary than a better tech who doesn't. I laugh when I hear that a company has taken a tech on what he has on paper over a tech who knows what he is doing, then the company pays the Paper tech extra becuase of his certs and the paper tech then has to ask one of the other techs there what to do when he comes across a simple problem. Believe me I have seen it and when I was asked I had to reply back with 'What you don't know how to FDISK a Hard disk???'. That is a serious answer that I had to give to a MCSE cert Tech. I later found out that he hadn't even built a computer or configured one, but the employment service told him to get a MCSE and he would get a job, to which he studied for, but couldn't do any of the tasks that he was set to do.

Sorry Certifications do not impress me.

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Darren Wilson
Webmaster
The Carpers Lodge.net
The Webs Number One Resource for Today's Carp Angler.

FLAMERS

[This message has been edited by Darren Wilson (edited February 18, 2001).]

[Cable Modem Tech]

I have no certs. out company was suposed to get us a+ which wouldnt be a bad idea, but with or with out the paper my co worker and i are going to continue to do the same work.... the cert is not going to make us better techs, yeah i have read the a+ manuals... and i know most of the stuff in there just passing the test isnt gong to make me a super tech.... yeah i know if i had the certs then i could get a better job... it is not fair how that is all employers look for.... but it is the truth...


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They get mad when they come to raid my pad and i'm out in the nine duece cad.

[Damned Angel]

I have A+, Hp and Toshiba.
Dont want to start a flame war or anything, but to all the people who think certs are useless, let me ask you this. Who would you want to work on your car? A guy who says he knows what hes doing, or a guy with all the papers to show he knows what he's doing?

I know which one I would pick...

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If it aint broke......use a bigger hammer

[hugheysoup]

No cert(s) but I am currently working on a degree. Degree is my primary importance then I will worry about getting the certifications.

I think reputation supercedes certification. I mean if I had a reputation that I known how to get things fixed on a computer and am very knowledgable, that is worth more than any certification.

But the thing is that not everyone knows of ones reputation so that is where a certifaction(s) are valuable.

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Why say no, when it feels sooo good to say yes?........

[jaimez]

There is a big difference between getting your apprenticeship as a car mechanic and getting your A+ exam. A car mechanic is actually taught how to troubleshoot and repair a car. A+ does not cover much of that at all. Passing the A+ or MCSE does not mean you know what you are doing unless you have at least 3 to 5 years in troubleshooting and repair.

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It's not rocket science, it's just a computer.

[Darren Wilson]

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Damned Angel:
I have A+, Hp and Toshiba.
Dont want to start a flame war or anything, but to all the people who think certs are useless, let me ask you this. Who would you want to work on your car? A guy who says he knows what hes doing, or a guy with all the papers to show he knows what he's doing?

I know which one I would pick...

</font>

The guy who comes recommended to me by others regardless of papaerwork. Knowing what to do and doing it are 2 different things. I could read a Haynes manual for a car on how to repair things but that wouldn't make me feel confident about doing it though. Nor would it make me feel confident about going into a garage and seeing loads of paperwork on the walls. I have taken cars to plenty of garages that have had the nessecary papaerwork and my car still wasn't fixed afterwards! Asked my next door neighbour to have a look at it for me (who isn't a mechanic but does the odd car repair and is self taught) and he sorted the problem out for me a lot cheaper than what the garages charged me. The car to this day still has the parts he fitted working fine!

Like I said in my original post, I have nothing against Techs who have hands on experience and the the certifications, it is the paper Techs that are the bad thing about this business.

Paper Techs = Done the exams and got the paperwork but have no idea on what they are doing.

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Darren Wilson
Webmaster
The Carpers Lodge.net
The Webs Number One Resource for Today's Carp Angler.

FLAMERS

[jimmr13]

Well yes I am certified ! And I still have alot to learn ! You never quit learning in this profession and belive me I see something new every day! Certs Below
BSCS, Cal.Berkley
MSCS, CSU,Fullerton
MCSE, 2000 MicroSoft
MCSE, 4.0 MicroSoft
MCP, MicroSoft
CNE, 5.0 Novell
CNA, Novell
Inet+, CompTIA
Net+, CompTIA
A+, CompTIA

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If all else fails read the directions !

[neilg]

I do have my MCSE, A+, CNA...I suree as hell do not know more then someone with a decent amount of experience. THose certs did help me break into the field, as I knew nothing about IT until I took my classes. I did go to a very reputable school w/ a great IT program.

All those damn books teach you a whole bunch of crap you will never think about again

[dlagace]

I dont agree with hiring the guy with papers over the guy that knows his stuff but thats the way this world works no papers no job. but if you could get that job without papers then you could show the your stuff and make them change thier way of hiring.

in my opinion if the company does give you some kind of change for the job then you really dont want to work for them. I currently have no certs just hands on which I say helps you learn alot faster. And I have recently been hired on by a company for hardware and software and network administration. and they said cert's were a must but I guess I've got the talk or something. any way.
I really hate it but cert's 90% of the time mean everything.

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IF IN DOUBT FDISK /MBR especially with
Windows (CTRL ALT DEL) 98

[Snommis69]

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Damned Angel:
Who would you want to work on your car? A guy who says he knows what hes doing, or a guy with all the papers to show he knows what he's doing?

I know which one I would pick...

</font>

I guess this explains why I do all the work on my cars, even though my wife manages a Pep Boys and can get a sweet discount.

I would not let those "certified" monkeys touch my car!

Regardless, I am not saying certs are bad, just that I do not put much stock in them. I will likely never get one, but for those who do, that is fine, but I still say the proof in in the puddin'. There are good and bad techs with certs, but some think the paper makes you good. Bah.

Oh, this is not a flame against certs or those with them. It is more at the dummies who belive a piece of paper = mastery, no paper = knucklehead.

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Is the damn thing plugged in, is the damn thing turned on?

[This message has been edited by Snommis69 (edited February 18, 2001).]

[exec2r]

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Snommis69:
Oh, this is not a flame against certs or those with them. It is more at the dummies who belive a piece of paper = mastery, no paper = knucklehead.
</font>

Exactly. Couldn't agree with you more.

[Jvaguy]

All my certs are A+, and compaq, and hp, and ibm, etc.. which to me doesnt mean a thing .. its what you keep learning .. and keep using .. and never overlook even a unpluged cable etc..

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1,2,3,4,5,6,7 all good children go to heaven

[NPaladin]

I'm A+ certified, and have completed the Cisco Networking Academy Program. I'm currently studying for my Network+ and CCNA exams, which will be followed up by the Win2K Pro and Networking Infrastructure and design MCSE exams.

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Bryan Pizzuti
CompTIA A+, CNAP
[email protected]
ICQ # 8525092
Yahoo Messenger: npaladin_2000