Printers disapearing form Printers menu.

[NettoBr]

Hello Folks,

I work in place with a 10 computers using win98 and I have a problem that occurs at least once a week.

Everybody is working and printing and suddenly all printers magically disapears from Printers menu from Win98, no more printing is possible.

The ONLY way to work again (for me) is to turn off all computers and hub, wait a litlle bit, and turn them all on again.

I think it is a problem of browsing, but I cant explain why local printers disapears too. I have had this problem in a old job, but after installing 1 printserver (black box) for the principal (heavy load) printer all this problems were gone.

Have anybody solved this problem. May be there is a hotfix for it.

Thanks from Brazil,

NettoBr

[confus-ed]

..Everybody is working and printing and suddenly all printers magically disapears from Printers menu from Win98, no more printing is possible.

The ONLY way to work again (for me) is to turn off all computers and hub, wait a litlle bit, and turn them all on again.

I think it is a problem of browsing, but I cant explain why local printers disapears too..

Welcome to WD forums NettoBr.

So the browsing bit sounds feasable indeed , 'master browser' issues might indeed do the kind of thing you are describing.

Can I just ask on 'printers disappears too' you mean you loose other shared resources too ? if so its almost certainly some master browsing issue.

'Master browser issues' are when computers in a workgroup as opposed to a domain, have trouble working out which machine is in charge of things for sharing resources & force an 'election' (the method of deciding which machine's in charge - a bit like in real life ) any new election result mightn't be right leading to resources disappearing - just why this happening I can't say from here, but no doubt there will be some reason.

This I think will be a start for you ;- Troubleshooting the Microsoft Computer Browser Service but thats more for NT & workgroups, if you answer my question, I/someone can probably find you more helpful stuff, it won't be a one patch fix, but probably take some tinkering, so its more important you understand the 'what & the why' of this than the how at first ..

[NettoBr]

Hello Confus ed,

Very creative nick name.

Thanks for your fast answer, and sorry about my not very good English.

Take a Look, I said "but I cant explain why local printers disapears too" from Printers List.

File shares remain ok, only printers disapears. Strange, isn't it?

Yes, it is a workgroup peer-to-peer network. There was a Win2k Server on the network but only acting as one more peer, without Domain, and the problem was the same way.

I've got some old issues (another client) about realtek nics crashing some Access Data Bases and after replacing all nics to 3COM problem has gone. Here I have a Mix of Realtek, Sys900 and one 3COM.

My old client, where I solved this problem, now I can remember better, I setup a Samba server acting (forced) as a master browser.

But may be not a browsing issue, but it looks like...

Thanks from Brazil

NettoBr

[confus-ed]

I do so wish there was a way here to show how 'expert' folks were before I ventured an answer .. there isn't. So forgive me if I was talking to you like a noob ! & I'm glad you like the nick name, I used to be just 'confused' (I still am often ! ) then when I started answering mostly rather than asking it seemed like a good idea

'Local printer' or any printer ? - I don't think it makes a difference ! - I'm thinking that as soon as you join a workgroup any potentially shared resource gets 'given' to whatever machine is deemed master browser server & its the fact that you can't access that is the issue - but I can't find that in 'black & white' anywhere for you, but its a 'big sneaky feeling' (same as you - failing memory !) & it 'just does that' if you have the file & printer sharing protocol turned on. & all this is a result of

SMB: Acronym for "Server Message Block". This is Microsoft's file and printer sharing protocol

(nicked from some linux documention on samba servers ! & the nearest I could find to something to back up my poor old memory !) - so a little test then maybe to prove that ? - make sure you have one 'completely local' (no file & print sharing at all on that machine) printer & next time it does it, is then gone ?

How are you overcoming the 'natural order of things' with these clients, for browser elections ? This is just the entire thing with workgroups - no guaranteed central point - as soon as I have more than 3 machines I'm wanting a 'certain' resolution point be that via a domain, or a wins server or whatever as the whole things just seems completely unreliable & as soon as M$ came up with notion of domains they just abandoned development of this ..

If this were my network, I'd set up a wins server to be 'boss' (ok so that means that one always has to be on) but at least then you know which machine you should be looking at.

(I'll be most interested to know what 'the hell' the answer might be ! - as really I'm ducking it & just saying use WINS instead )

[chenrysjr]

What type of AV are you running on your systems? We had a similar problem some time back and it turned out to be an issue with McAfee. You might want to check their site for information. I'll look and see if I can find the exact fix we used.

[garthg]

Hello Folks,

I work in place with a 10 computers using win98 and I have a problem that occurs at least once a week.

Everybody is working and printing and suddenly all printers magically disapears from Printers menu from Win98, no more printing is possible.

The ONLY way to work again (for me) is to turn off all computers and hub, wait a litlle bit, and turn them all on again.

I think it is a problem of browsing, but I cant explain why local printers disapears too. I have had this problem in a old job, but after installing 1 printserver (black box) for the principal (heavy load) printer all this problems were gone.

Have anybody solved this problem. May be there is a hotfix for it.

Thanks from Brazil,

NettoBr

Just to let everone Know there is a Limit to the workgroup and that is 10 machines. That is why there is a problem with the Master Browser. If the 2000 server was a Domain server and the workstations loged in on the domain there is no limit.

Gary

[NettoBr]

Very good,

Options are multiplying (by 3).

All right garthg,
I always had in mind that 8 was a maximum number of machines for a WorkGroup. But it's in my mind, Not Official. Is 10 an official recommendation??? It Makes some sense.

Good hint chenrysjr, too early to say that it is this... But may be. It makes sense, too.

Now I am using AVG 7.0 PRO official, bought an registred... in all 10 Machines.But in my old client I was using Mcafee.

Consus ed
In Theory, Wins Server, is used to force Netbios Name Resolution in a multi-network environment, where broadcast can't propagate, cause routers deny its propagation. This way Wins Server, pointed in each host, can tell the actual IP for a giving name.

There, All machines have to use a network printer, I can only setup a machine without printer if I put one of mine and if I can find a small place to put it (very dificult).

I am Implementing a Linux server, but it will be ready in 2 Weeks, cause I am starting to buy the server. Is there a way to force the election for a Win98 Machine??? In Samba Its is clear but in Microsoft I think is a Hiden parameter.

Another Information, ALL Printers desapears from Printers menu in ALL 10 Computers of my 10 Computers Network (local or networked Printers).

I am Thinking that some NIC is making the mess around.

Thanks for the ideas.

NettoBr

[confus-ed]

This then ? Troubleshooting Server Message Block inbound connection limit in Windows peer-to-peer workgroup
Concurrent connections not number in a workgroup apparently ..

..Computers that run Windows NT Workstation 4.0, Windows 2000 Professional, and Windows XP Professional are licensed for a maximum of 10 concurrent client incoming sessions. Computers that run Windows XP Home Edition are licensed for a maximum of 5 concurrent client incoming sessions. All logical drive, logical printer, and transport level connections combined from a single computer are one session...

(I know mostly these are 98 clients & the article doesn't have them as 'effects..' but I think it'll probably hold - I think the general rule of thumb is, that the more interworking {using each other resources} & clients you have, the more the need a proper server architecture also applies..).

Oh & on using wins - this is why .. & no extra licenses !

Why Use WINS? Other than reducing overall network traffic, the use of WINS also effectively promotes overall resolution speed (i.e. faster browsing from your computer to others).

from here

Is there a way to force the election for a Win98 Machine???

Yeah .. there's a registery key, Controlling browser elections

Note: 'Auto' can be problematical with 'higher' rankings esp for 98 ! ..

[NettoBr]

Hello Confus ed,

www.sanx.org is not available.

I'll wait

Netto BR

Thanks from Brazil (Land of beutiful places and women).