Brand name computers, why buy them?

[TechZ]

Mostly, its as easy as,

Son: I have a pc, its giving me probs
Dad: Go to the shop pay BD5 and they will do a full resinstall with all the apps u want.

Piracy, its a way of life. Support stinks from local vendors, part are cheap (quality not price)

I help my pals out and build my own pc's.

[Gabriel]

I have to disagree to some extent.
I have many Dell Stations, the computer are reliable + I get 3 years of on site Warranty - Parts and Labour included (which saves me tons of headache when it comes to Hardware breakdown).
Do I prefer to pay a bit more - 20-35%
and have slower computer - the guys/gals in the office wouldn't know the difference with the application suite they are using.
And have a piece of mind for 3 years.


Thank you,
Gabriel

[Ferrit]

Gotta agree with Click here re: the brand names, I've been having so many headaches with IBM's, Comcraps and Halfarsed Prickards that it makes you wonder how naive the consumer can be. I mean would you buy a car just for its engine size alone, regarless of brakes, suspension, steering, tyres, interior etc etc.

More often than not as said above they sell on CPU alone and use inferior mainboards with the whole world and then some "onboard" leave little room for upgrades (even then only using their bits), underspeed RAM and HDD, and non standard screws ... I mean why? Does anyone have a good explanation as to why Compaq use non standard screws? I'd love to know!

And as for the cases ......

Right yer joking? No I see your not
Dont you see the game.
1: I build a pc.
2: It can only be fixed using my parts
3: I charge astronomical prices for those parts.
4: I laugh and deposit all yer cash knowing full well you will be back

Man what a sweet game
Oh and dont worry I have no concious
Right Merry Xmas too

[buksida]

I think the point was .... great for the huge corporations that are doing this, not so great for the likes of us who have to fix the crap and the consumers that are suffering as a result. How often have you lost business buy having to tell the customer that the machine needs to go back to the supplier, usually 300 miles away, because none of your standard parts will work in it?

Unless of course you are in fact the CEO of Comcrap then I must eat humble pie and say "well done old chap"

[HipHoper]

Those proprietary systems might come with a P4, but it's usually only a 400MHz FSB which is why it's so slow. Plus it's usually just cheap memory. When people ask me to help them work on their proprietary computer, I usually just tell them to call the tech support for it. I mean, might as well take advantage of it as long as it's there.

As long as it's there.......HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHA

[InTheWayBoy]

I guess I'll throw my thoughts in on this...Big Box computers are great...they generally are feature rich, and usually use good parts. All you who are saying they don't, you may not have looked at the right. HP for instance uses ASUS to make it's motherboards and other parts. You have to remember one thing though:

THE ONLY COMPUTERS WE ARE SEEING ARE THE ONES THAT NEED FIXING!!!

That's not the only computers they have ever made...for every one broken computer there are probably twenty good ones. Trust me, I've worked at CompUSA as tech, and now I run my own repair company, so I've seen both sides.

Now I won't stand up for them and their screwy little things like non standard screws (Compaq), different power supply pin-outs (Dell), and over-all crappy case design (HP)...but you can't expect them to be too nice. They are greedy S.O.B.'s in the end. But don't let that make you think their products are bad.

In fact, I dare say that overall they have a higher reliability rate than most white box companies. I don't even try and build them anymore, because after it's all said and done the little money that I can make off the parts is quickly pissed away after the extensive support calls to morons. Don't forget, another aspect of these 'broken' PC's is the users are idiots most of the time. I used to refurb machines at CompUSA, and about 60% of the time there was no hardware problem, just software or a short in the ID10T interface

Yeah tech support is all in India...yeah, they don't care about a customers data...but you have to think they are working in the same economy as ours. Can you:

1. Offer a system with little to no markup on parts (They generally make only 3% if I recall correctly)
2. Offer at least a one year parts and labor, and offer a three year upgrade for only $100-$200
3. Offer 24/7 Phone Tech Support
4. Ship and recieve units
5. Repair parts

And still make a profit? I know by my rates, that's imposiible, so I don't even try. Our service calls are $89 flat, which is a great deal. But if a customer calls us out more than once over a year, which is too easy to happen, then I'm now loosing money, as I only made roughly $100 on the markup of the parts.

If you're gonna do it like a business, and I mean really do it, not some half-*** on the side thing, then you'll start to see the apparent problems with the system. I feel that they are doing they best that they can given the situation, and as such I am taking advantage of it. Many people don't like calling India, so even if it's under warranty they still call me. Works out in the end...better even, as then I don't have to worry about parts!

And the last thing they have is style and design. True, we can get some cool cases, but then your drives don't match. And we don't get to design cool gadgets like the media-readers and hard drive enclosures and such. Hell, Sony always manages to impress me, if not only for the balls to try new things.

[CeeBee]

HP for instance uses ASUS to make it's motherboards and other parts.

..And a standard mobo won't fit the case when the crappy ASUS fails (maybe due to the under-rated 150W PSU?), and a replacement can be ordered from HP for "only" $150 or more + shipping, driving the cost of the repair close to the price of a new PC...
The fact is that you cannot achieve these prices ($400 for a Gateway P.O.S. with monitor) and still make some profit without sacrificing quality. But the average Joe has no idea about Gigapixels, how many Megahertz the HDD has and how many GB the CPU has...

[InTheWayBoy]

..And a standard mobo won't fit the case when the crappy ASUS fails (maybe due to the under-rated 150W PSU?), and a replacement can be ordered from HP for "only" $150 or more + shipping, driving the cost of the repair close to the price of a new PC...
The fact is that you cannot achieve these prices ($400 for a Gateway P.O.S. with monitor) and still make some profit without sacrificing quality. But the average Joe has no idea about Gigapixels, how many Megahertz the HDD has and how many GB the CPU has...

Exactly! In this current economy people want everything faster, cheaper, and quicker. Sadly most consumers have no idea about what really goes on in a computer, and really are too lazy to invest time to figure it out. When you buy a car, most people research the hell out of it. With computers, they mainly are uneducated. So they don't care if it has a 300W PSU, a standard ATX motherboard, or generic RAM. They care about what it can do, how much it costs, and who is gonna take care of it when it's broke. So the Big Box's are just giving the consumer what they want. Yes, they could take a stand and require all the computers they sell to use premium parts, but then the consumers would moan and groan to no end. It's a vicious cycle really...

Sure you and I can get a similar motherboard for $70, but that's just cost, you can't go by just that. This kinda hints to what I was talking about earlier...since they make so little off the initial purchase, and make very little if any off support, then their last recourse is to attempt to make money off replacement parts. You charge a markup on your parts right? Well so do they...but their operating costs dwarf all of out put together, so they feel they should charge more. It's simple really...the smaller the company, the lower the overhead, the less the markup. While it may seem gross and greedy, and it is inherently, it's the way they do business. Any industry has those failings...look at the automotive industry! You always pay more going to the dealer. But generally you get better support, a better warranty, installation, etc. That's all part of the markup. Do you think the people answering the phone, shipping the products, and cataloging the parts index all do that for free?

And I hope the Megahertz of your HDD doesn't exceed the GB of the CPU in your system, that could be ugly...

[RejectionMan]

I buy them becasue I know im getting the same equipment for each workstation rahter than a bunch of cobbled togetehr systems that are nearly the same. They deliver on time, they stand by their warranty, the provide service level agreements, they are problay going to stay in business, and are large enough to meet my volume needs.

why i dont use local retailers:

everytime i have dealt with a local dealer they have screwed me, limmited warratys (make me chase the manufacture), want me to wait for the RMA to arrive (will only do so after the defect part is at manufacturer), no SLA's, generaly cost more, and they want to sell me crap mother boards (unless I special order)

to much hassel, give me dell any day of the week and thrice on sunday.

[Ferrit]

I buy them becasue I know im getting the same equipment for each workstation rahter than a bunch of cobbled togetehr systems that are nearly the same. They deliver on time, they stand by their warranty, the provide service level agreements, they are problay going to stay in business, and are large enough to meet my volume needs.

why i dont use local retailers:

everytime i have dealt with a local dealer they have screwed me, limmited warratys (make me chase the manufacture), want me to wait for the RMA to arrive (will only do so after the defect part is at manufacturer), no SLA's, generaly cost more, and they want to sell me crap mother boards (unless I special order)

to much hassel, give me dell any day of the week and thrice on sunday.

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA yer joking right?
Now you may have had a bad experience with your local computer shop I will grant ya that
but the rest is kinda funny really
You phoned the infamous Dell tech support since they moved it offshore?

[InTheWayBoy]

You phone a local computer service center after 9:00PM?

[TripleRLtd]

The way this thread has progressed is quite revealing. Big Box/Name Brand has alot to offer, undoubtably. Especially when you don't buy their "loss leaders" that you see advertised on tv.
Consumers do not understand the difference yet between a "Yugo" and a "Mercedes" as of yet (to repeat myself...), and that may be our fault. Of course you can get a good "Comcrap". And, of course, they also have pc's that run for $1500, not just $500. Do you all think there is not a difference between their high and and their low end? Come on. Also, how about between their Business Division and their Consumer Division? Who is YOUR best customer after all?
Yeah, they know what they are doing! After all, we are talking about the last of the great pc makers to survive and become godzillas.
Who thinks Gateway is next to fall?

[thorian]

Makes my job selling a quality computer SOOOOOOOOOOOOO much easier
all it takes is them owning 1 emachine gateway or compaq

Dont forget that Emachines and gateway merged this year to make more crap boxen. I only reccommended a Dell to a aunt that I dint feel like making a 300 mile service call to fix it. I also told her she needed a 3 yr warrenty as they will use it.

[RejectionMan]

dell just opend a new call center in my city. They answer in less than 1 min. now. b4 i always got routed to texas and it took all of 15 min to get a real person.

I have dealt with over 6 local dealers and only one has not screwed me, the rest are all run by asian gangs im sure, uber low prices, only 7 day warranty on parts, and when you call the manufacturer they tell you its refurbished so your SOL.

sure the $550 models are probaly scary, but thats we we buy optiplex business machines, casue thats what we use them for.

gateway is done, dont know what they were thinking buying that titanic e-machines.. the sucktion from it sinking will surly pull them in to.

[bbtech6650]

Gotta agree with Click here re: the brand names, I've been having so many headaches with IBM's, Comcraps and Halfarsed Prickards that it makes you wonder how naive the consumer can be. I mean would you buy a car just for its engine size alone, regarless of brakes, suspension, steering, tyres, interior etc etc.

More often than not as said above they sell on CPU alone and use inferior mainboards with the whole world and then some "onboard" leave little room for upgrades (even then only using their bits), underspeed RAM and HDD, and non standard screws ... I mean why? Does anyone have a good explanation as to why Compaq use non standard screws? I'd love to know!

And as for the cases ......

I agree with ya on the slowness, I had someone ask me to get them a computer, not build them one, but find a "name branded" one, cause they were more reliable.

So, I had them buy a refurb hp from tiger, and lo and behold, got a call that it took an insane amount of time 2 load.

So, I reloaded the OS (xp home) and trashed the useless hp added "bonus software" and the pc was not the same, it FLEW!!!

It should be an option what ppl want installed on their pc when comming from the factory, not just assume that every1 wants, or needs the kitchen sink in there!!!!!!


useless software!!!!