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[quote]Originally posted by EvilCabbage:
<strong>OK, let me clarify then.
I have not seen one single intelligent public statement, from Bush, that didnt make him look like a puppet. A weak figurehead, will all the backbone of a squid.
Perhaps the media is just painting a bad picture of him for us.</strong><hr></blockquote>
They must be. Bush does not look like a puppet. He doesn't look like a weak figurehead, and he definately doesn't have the 'backbone of a squid'. He sticks to his standards, he speaks strongly and reassuritavely, he doesn't back down.
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[quote]Originally posted by gxavier:
<strong>
They must be. Bush does not look like a puppet. He doesn't look like a weak figurehead, and he definately doesn't have the 'backbone of a squid'. He sticks to his standards, he speaks strongly and reassuritavely, he doesn't back down.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Heh you Americans, 98% of you dont even know there are other countries outside the US. How many of you could even name the British Prime Minister without looking it up?
The whole world knows about Bush, but yer average US citizen is quite happy listening to just the one source of propaganda.
Sure yeah sabre rattling is good for votes - and the louder he blabs like that the harder the guys that have to do the real work of foreign policy have to work.
Presidents in the past have wiped out years of progress with other countries with stupid vote catching remarks. Bush won't be the last by any manner of means.
America wake up - you are not the most powerful country in the world - didn't 9-11 teach you anything? That you as a target is as vunerable as anyone else.
OK enough with the arm chair politics.
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[quote]Originally posted by gxavier:
<strong>
They must be. Bush does not look like a puppet. He doesn't look like a weak figurehead, and he definately doesn't have the 'backbone of a squid'. He sticks to his standards, he speaks strongly and reassuritavely, he doesn't back down.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Ok... Cast your mind back to the election campaign, didnt seem to sharp then, did he? Then the voting.. thanks a lot for that florida.. at least then half the country didnt like him. Good sign? Methinks not.
9/11, as disasterous and ghastly as it was, was the best thing to happen to that dopey git.
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He seemed plenty sharp. Just because one stumbles once or twice in his speech doesn't mean they are the dumbest **** on the planet.
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We never said we weren't a target. I dont know who has said that. But it wasn't an American. We have always been vulnerable to terrorist attacks. No one is safe. The towers were attacked once before, if you remember. Blew the entire mall/basement up. Took years to fix it all up.
And Noonoo, you just showed that the UK has problems with misconceptions about America. For one, your silly remark about Americans not knowing who the British Prime Minister is without looking it up is crazy. Tony Blair is probably the second most known man in world politics. Americans ARENT dumb. We aren't just a bunch of trailer trash, simpsons watching, wife beating, insest screwing, fat beer drinking men with guns. And sadly, thats what most of the world thinks the majority is.
But Noonoo, I can't blame you guys for starting the misconceptions. Its media that goes to "the heart of the street", asking questions to the dumbest person they can find, ala Jay Leno, that gives America the bad wrap. So maybe we bring it on ourselves.
But yes. In my opition, we are the most powerful nation on the planet, with the strongest, most technological military, the most secure failsafed government, and some of the best people.
But what do I know. Im just an American.
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Ok, I am an American, I have studied politics at length, and I do not trust Bush at all. There it has been said.
This constant foibling around finding more targets and enemies to fight, claiming victories when some watered down bill finally passes the house and gets stopped in the senate. Why is he loved so much? What has he really done?
Yes, we are at war, but a claim to stomp out all terrorism and to give a man like Bush a blank check to do as his advisors sees fit is a bad, bad thing. We should take out those responsible, but it is not our position or our right to take on all terrorism. Here in america we have terrorism, is he going to nuke the PETA for stopping boy scout fishing, is he going to nuke the religious right for bombing abortion clinics. Lets bomb the Irish while we are at it as well. Bush is said to be a great man, and for what, it is already been decided that his staff does all the work, he barely makes it through speeches, and all he has done is what any person would do given the situation. Heck his staff was handpicked for him from the greats that his dad worked with, and that the Republican party told him to pick.
I am sorry, but I cannot give my full support to this man, and the more that he does the less confidence I have in him. That being said, I fully appreciate and support everyone in the armed services that are putting their lives on the line to keep us safe. I support the fireman, the policeman and damnit the police dogs. These are the ones who have my vote, they are the ones showing true strength. Not some beady eyed rich spoiled son of a good, honest man.
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Cleetus. Where, oh WHERE, do you get the idea that Bush, Jr. is a "rich beady eyed son"? Have you ever met him? Have you ever worked with him? No. You haven't. And for those reasons, you cannot make those accusations based on what you see or hear on your local newstation.
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[quote]Originally posted by gxavier:
<strong>But what do I know. Im just an American.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Could be part of the problem...
If the American system is so damn good, why are there metal detectors in schools? Why is the social security system just as broken as everywhere elses? Why is the justice system so damn corrupted?
Maybe if people werent so damn quick to pat themselves on the back...
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If you think Bush, Jr. Is a retard, look at JFK. John F. Kennedy (D) is considered one of the greatest presidents ever, even by Republicans. He was also considered not very smart in highschool, college, and his early political career. He wasn't a good speaker, he stumbled quite a bit, and people thought he was just a pawn.
I honestly don't get where you people get off, and get the facts to support the statements that "Bush is dumb". Hes no more dumb than you are.
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[quote]Originally posted by EvilCabbage:
<strong>
Could be part of the problem...
If the American system is so damn good, why are there metal detectors in schools? Why is the social security system just as broken as everywhere elses? Why is the justice system so damn corrupted?
Maybe if people werent so damn quick to pat themselves on the back...</strong><hr></blockquote>
Um. If the American system is so bad, then why have hundreds of governments thrown away their old, and started their new, westernized governments, based on our Constitution and Bill of Rights?
Since when is our Justice system "corrupted"?
There aren't metal detectors in schools. Well I take that back, Ive only seen one metal detector in a school before, and that was Columbine, right after school got back in. But they took them out about 3 months after. And thats not an American System issue. How could it be? I suppose its Bush's fault for doing that? Oh wait...that was a Democrat leadership. So I guess that can't be true. Our "American System" had NOTHING to do with any school shootings. They could have happened ANYWHERE else.
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You cant honestly be telling me, that he has achieved such status, off his own back. If those arabs hadnt been studying kamikaze 101, he wouldnt be half the 'glorious leader' he apparently is now.
I didnt say his speeches where bad (they're written by in-house plebs either way), I said he does not appear to be a strong man, in any respect, intellect or otherwise. Now, if you have someone in power, that may not be the brightest buld on the tree, but has a great supporting crew, thats fine. But when your supporting crew is telling you to push a few buttons, kill a few more arabs, its time to emigrate.
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I dont deny that the real leadership lies in the President's Cabinet...but that makes America strong. You have to remember that the President himself makes up the biggest influence in his own Cabinet.
We are only killing "a few more arabs" to protect us, you, and your kids. If you would rather prefer to allow Saddam Hussein finish creating his nuclear arsenal, fine. I hope you enjoy raising your children in a post-apocalyptic world.
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There are metal detectors in our schools. Bush does have beady little eyes, his father is rich, he was handed many different companies that he ran into the ground, didn't do much with the Rangers, led the nastiest political campaign I have ever seen to beat out Grandma Richards for the Governer of Texas.
We do know some about other cultures but not enough. For instance, many many Americans who hear of Nelson Mandela think he is another Martin Luther King Jr. when in fact he publicly endorsed mass violence against the whites, and his wife ordered the death of thousands. Most do not know these things nor do they care about the facts.
Please do not get me wrong though. I am an American, I defend her honor, but I do not shy away from the problems we have either. Yes we are at war for maybe our way of life, but when I see that way being taken away by our own government(see the post on policeware) then I take my responsibility as an American to shout out my distaste for what the government is doing wrong.
As we here on Windrivers are from all over and share the universal language of technology and hatred for the common (l)user, so does all of mankind need to grow to learn how we all can interact with each other. Americans can not force this to happen as the international police, the UN is too corupt to do this themselves, and the rest of the world needs to learn to appreciate us for who we are. Americans are formed from those leaving all the other cultures, we are the ugly junk yard mutts, but somehow we come out on top, and you can't really blame us for being proud.
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This maybe a bit off topic......I'm not here to defend or disparage Bush. I'm looking at the consequences of acting now vs doing nothing.
Well, eventually we will have to deal with Saddam. Do we do it now..with his chemical/biological/nuclear capacity in its infancy or do we wait for him to unleash weapons of mass distruction on his neighbors or our Allies. How long do think Israel would last if the Islamic nations that sponser terrorism had access to these weapons. And don't think about living in your happy "we are the world-all we need is love" bubble because Iran/Iraq/Syria and many others have repeatedly demonstrated their willingness to use weapons of mass destruction upon domestic and foreign "threats". in addition most reasonable intelligence agencies believe Israel has has nuclear capability since a few years before/after the 6 Day War. SO..lets say the worst case. A nuclear "device" goes off or is spotted heading toward Israel, well, most of the Arabic nations around her will also cease to exist. Then with the world in a tizzy Pakistan and India decide to finish their looong dispute over Kashmir. It starts as a "conventional" exchange but then they call in their nuclear weapons. While this is going on what will the rest of the world do, now that most of the middle east is now a glassy crater, well, they'll move in to try to salvage/claim the vital oil deposits, and what do you think will happen then? Of course this may be my paranioa talking, but it seems feasible. Or imagine this scenario, a single or several low-mid yeild 50-150KT devices are detonated in our cities...the total would easily include several dozen civilian mega-deaths. Now imagine the Israel scenario then but the US as Israel...In my mind it makes more sense to me to kill the beast while it is still young, than have it grow and spread. Any doctor will tell you it is best to excise a cancer early. Only moral cowardice would allow madmen to pursue these weapons which the few nations with have have/had them recognize the potential evil they could wreak and thus have resolved to NOT use them unless NO OTHER RECOURSE REMAINS. Of course I'm ranting and maybe this makes sense...
REMEMBER THIS: ALL that is neccesary for the triumph of EVIL is that good men DO NOTHING
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[quote]Originally posted by NooNoo:
<strong>
Heh you Americans, 98% of you dont even know there are other countries outside the US. How many of you could even name the British Prime Minister without looking it up?
</strong><hr></blockquote>
Tony Blair.
Didn't have to look it up. :p :p :D
