He does know and he is pissed.Quote:
Originally posted by drewmaztech
If jesus knew what was done "in his name" - he'd be PISSED.
:D
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He does know and he is pissed.Quote:
Originally posted by drewmaztech
If jesus knew what was done "in his name" - he'd be PISSED.
:D
However guising your attack by appearing to advocate the most extreme "christian" positions is intellectually dishonest. The fact is that you can no more hold every Christian to the most extreme beliefs than any other religious or non-religious group. Every group has an extreme element. The key is whether those extreme elements define the rest of the group.Quote:
Originally posted by imaeditedbysowulo
Those are not my beliefs at all, merely my interpretation of what the church believes. I agree with you that it's not okay for churches to be hypocritical now, that's exactly why I don't support any churches. I think they are all filled with hypocrites.
However, just because I think it's a whole bunch of baloney doesn't exclude me from understanding the beliefs of someone that is highly religious, and I support their right to believe those things.
I've got no argument there.Quote:
Originally posted by ilovetheusers
If I were to put in my 2 cents (which I am) I'd have to say that Jewish people are the most persecuted group through out time.
Let's also remember the Roman Emporers, the Moors, the Islamic Empire, the Soviet Union, Cambodia, Iran and China. All resulted in tens of millions in Christian genocide. Also, of all the child molesters in the world, Catholic priests only make up a fraction of a percent.Quote:
Originally posted by ilovetheusers
Lets not forget the crusades, the dark ages the inquisition, persecution of political rulers, scientists and artist and whole groups of people and the molestation of children with a subsequent cover up by the higher up clergy is the most recent.
This is a requirement based in Old Testament laws. While the New Testament still maintains that homosexuality is sin, the appropriate response is forgiveness and love. The is why Christ stood up for the woman who would have been stoned.Quote:
Originally posted by goinpostal
Please explain to me if this doesnt say Kill Homosexuals
Christ's death and resurrection did not invalidate the OT laws, it just replaced the requirement for automatic punishment with the opportunity for forgiveness.
Thank you Mayet for that jewel of truth... :D :D :D although there are religious people who understand cause and effect and personal responsibility, many of them are in this very thread. :cool:Quote:
Originally posted by Mayet
Religion is what stops society from growing as a whole and understanding cause and effect and the responsability of ones own actions
Religion was created to control the masses
and really christianity is new at it
Now here's where I have the problem with your statement... can you present to me any sort of convincing evidence that the Bible actually describes what God wants, and that He doesn't think it is a bunch of bullcrap as well?Quote:
Originally posted by KINGofBLEH
Refer back to Romans chapter 1 for the Biblical position on the morality of it. That trumps any possibility that God would introduce something that he regards as inherently wrong as a pop check.
"Dear God, don't know if You noticed, but, you're name is on a lot of quotes in this book... as crazy humans wrote it You should take a look... and all the people that You made in Your image, still believing that junk is true, well I know it ain't and so do You Dear God..."
I mean, what is really so off about that song? How do you know God wrote the Bible? The simple answer is, you don't. Your priests and your parents told you it was true, so you assume it must be.
Okay, so I have another question for yeah...which religion is right?:D
That is an extremely important statement.Quote:
Originally posted by KINGofBLEH
This is a requirement based in Old Testament laws. While the New Testament still maintains that homosexuality is sin, the appropriate response is forgiveness and love. The is why Christ stood up for the woman who would have been stoned.
Christ's death and resurrection did not invalidate the OT laws, it just replaced the requirement for automatic punishment with the opportunity for forgiveness.
The fact that homosexuality is even mentioned in the Old Testament bears witness to how long homosexuality has been around. It is not going to go away regardless of punishment or restriction.
A lot of the "christians" I have met spout their love of Jesus, but have an Old Testament mentality.
From my point of view Jesus was a sensible guy that looked around him at the punishment and horrors perpertrated in God's name and called time on them, because he found that the priests and high officials enjoyed the power and the control and probably the punishment of others too.
My other concern is that if Jesus really did return would the Catholic and other christian churches believe? I say probably not.
Assuming you actually want an answer? ;)Quote:
Originally posted by Orangeman
Okay, so I have another question for yeah...which religion is right?
The Biblical one is:
Pure and undefiled religion before Father God is this:
to assist orphans and widows in their trouble, to keep oneself untainted by the (corrupt) world.
James 1:27
Jesus voiced the same concern;Quote:
Originally posted by NooNoo
if Jesus really did return would the Catholic and other christian churches believe?
"when the Son of Man returns, will he (actually) find faith on the earth?"
in Luke 18:8
So much to say, so late at night...
Good thread.
Would Jesus approve of Boybands, and if so, when he comes back, would he join one?:confused:
Jesus was in a boy band!!!
MC J and the 12 apostles!!!!
Wait a sec Jesus never had a girlfriend.... and hung around with his "Apostles" all of which were men... never married.... no kids... wore a MOO MOO like robe.... and was sooo lite in the loafers he could walk on water???
And we are debating gays and the bible??????
Flame on!!!!
:flame:
Neither is bestiality, child molestation or statutory rape. That doesn't make them right. :(Quote:
Originally posted by NooNoo
That is an extremely important statement.
The fact that homosexuality is even mentioned in the Old Testament bears witness to how long homosexuality has been around. It is not going to go away regardless of punishment or restriction.
If your Gay and a Christian and your worried about all this sin stuff, just come over to the UK. You can even become a priest; just so long as you don't touch another mans "thingy". As far as the Church of England is concerned it's the act's not the love bit. There are openly gay clergy in the CofE...
But then you don't have to actually believe in god to be in the CofE just nice to people... Our new Arch Bishop would have been nailed to something rotten, if McCarthy had ever gotten hold of him. His politics are so far left of centre he would have scared Lenin...
Sounds Unitarian. :D
Never said they didn't or that christians were never persecuted.;)Quote:
Originally posted by KINGofBLEH
Let's also remember the Roman Emporers, the Moors, the Islamic Empire, the Soviet Union, Cambodia, Iran and China. All resulted in tens of millions in Christian genocide.
Never known you to ever say anything you couldn't back up but - how do you know that? I would bet almost any amount of $$ that you have a stat somewhere or you would not have said it, but... Are child molesters lining up to take a survey?:rolleyes: :DQuote:
Originally posted by KINGofBLEH
Also, of all the child molesters in the world, Catholic priests only make up a fraction of a percent.
The argument was that if they were not priests, more would have gone to jail. Further if this was say "procter and gamble" doing the ocver up you would be assured that there would have been a prosecuter nailing someone to the wall. The bishops (or whoever) who moved the priests around (and basically aided them in molesting others) were never held acountable. Having your name in the press does not make up for aiding molesters in raping and harming more children.
If this was a different, non major religious group they would have been nailed to the wall. That was what I was getting at. they got a pass because they were Christian. Any other group would have been persecuted. Any "persecution" that went on in the press was overwhelmingly deserved and honestly was no where near enough IMHO.
BTW - glad to see you posting again. :)
Are you trying to claim that homosexuality is as bad as these other things?Quote:
Originally posted by meatwad
Neither is bestiality, child molestation or statutory rape. That doesn't make them right. :(
Thanks Platypus,Quote:
Originally posted by Platypus
Assuming you actually want an answer? ;)
The Biblical one is:
Pure and undefiled religion before Father God is this:
to assist orphans and widows in their trouble, to keep oneself untainted by the (corrupt) world.
James 1:27
I wasn't looking for an answer, mostly I was providing comic relief.
However.....I guess that lets me out!:D
I think it is more important to debate why are Homosexuals the way they are. Is it truly a mater of genetics and can't be altered; or is it a social choice?
Bottom line, whether it is an irreversible behavioral disorder or a choice, acceptance isn't a reasonable solution. Choosing to abstain or pursue a relationship with the opposite sex is the only option. To expect or demand others to accept homosexual behavior as normal is not socially acceptable!
I am not religious, and wont try to use that card, hence I have stayed out of this thread this long. Morally we all have faults, but homosexuality is just strange. I don’t want to be a part of a society that so easily accepts this as normal!!!
Don't come to my house for thanksgiving dinner then!!!!
I didn't_know I was ever invited!Quote:
Originally posted by Cleetus
Don't come to my house for thanksgiving dinner then!!!!
I didn't know that Pendragon. Tell me, what does Queen Elizabeth think about his politics?Quote:
Originally posted by Pendragon
If your Gay and a Christian and your worried about all this sin stuff, just come over to the UK. There are openly gay clergy in the CofE...
But then you don't have to actually believe in god to be in the CofE just nice to people... Our new Arch Bishop (is so) far left of centre he would have scared Lenin...
Orangeman:confused:
I don't really see the difference. That's all.Quote:
Originally posted by Wayward Clam
Are you trying to claim that homosexuality is as bad as these other things?
Well, you said you didn't want to be a part of society that accepted homosexuality, and my brother is gay, so you wouldn't want to come over, as we could all really care less in my household wether you are gay or not. It is all about character, not who you sleep with.
So(with tongue stuck out childishly) pthththththththt
Look Cletus, if you want to sleep with your mother or sister, I'm fine with that. But sleeping with your brother. Eeeeeew. :p :D
You see Cleetus that is the problem. If your brother is gay, you shouldn't accept that behavior. I never said you should shun him out of your family. Accepting this behavior is what has gotten us into this mess of people arguing this point and that about it. It should have never been a part of our society, 2000 years ago, or today, bible or not. We need to educate homosexuals so they no longer are!!!
To be quite honest, I would have come over with the pumpkin pie, but since you stuck your tongue out at me, I don't think I like you anymore.
Educate them until they no longer are? What century do you live in?
Say, did any of you know that psychologists actually say that people who are afraid of or hate homosexuality typicaly have supressed homosexual tendencies...:rolleyes:
Some of you guys trying to tell us something??
http://fish.dirtylittle.com/tehgay.jpg
Well lots of famous people are gay, including Catholic priests, why not Jesus?:D :DQuote:
Originally posted by goinpostal
Jesus was in a boy band!!!
MC J and the 12 apostles!!!!
Wait a sec Jesus never had a girlfriend.... and hung around with his "Apostles" all of which were men... never married.... no kids... wore a MOO MOO like robe.... and was sooo lite in the loafers he could walk on water???
:flame:
(....you forgot to add that the 12 apostles deliberately excluded women from their ranks...why?)
That's true Clam, but how do you know that humans made it to the moon? Because someone told you so? Did you see it live on TV (if you are old enough that is not sure of your age)? Do you know for 100% not even the slightest inkling of doubt that humans were on the moon? Answer: No Why? Because you were not there yourself. All of it could have been staged by the government in a soundstage in Hollywood to make it look like we spent all of that money on the space program when in fact it was going into funds for Area 51. Ok so that is a far fetched explaination. But it has merrit.Quote:
Originally posted by Wayward Clam
How do you know God wrote the Bible? The simple answer is, you don't. Your priests and your parents told you it was true, so you assume it must be.
How do you know that it was Julius Ceasar even existed? You dont't know. Why? Because you weren't there to know him in person as the Roman ruler.
Both examples require us to trust those who teach us History. We have to go by what is taught to us by people and what has been written about the events that we learn. But then, that would require us to have *Faith*.
Socrates said that True wisdom is to admit that we know nothing. That means that nothing, and The Rock means Nothing, is for certain except death and taxes.
Just as our parents and priests told us that God exsists, school teachers teach us that there are nine planets in the solar system (speculation of a possible 10th but not proven). You choose to believe what you want to believe, because almost everything about the past and present requires faith.
Three points:Quote:
Originally posted by Jediab
That's true Clam, but how do you know that humans made it to the moon? Because someone told you so? Did you see it live on TV (if you are old enough that is not sure of your age)? Do you know for 100% not even the slightest inkling of doubt that humans were on the moon? Answer: No Why? Because you were not there yourself. All of it could have been staged by the government in a soundstage in Hollywood to make it look like we spent all of that money on the space program when in fact it was going into funds for Area 51. Ok so that is a far fetched explaination. But it has merrit.
How do you know that it was Julius Ceasar even existed? You dont't know. Why? Because you weren't there to know him in person as the Roman ruler.
Both examples require us to trust those who teach us History. We have to go by what is taught to us by people and what has been written about the events that we learn. But then, that would require us to have *Faith*.
Socrates said that True wisdom is to admit that we know nothing. That means that nothing, and The Rock means Nothing, is for certain except death and taxes.
Just as our parents and priests told us that God exsists, school teachers teach us that there are nine planets in the solar system (speculation of a possible 10th but not proven). You choose to believe what you want to believe, because almost everything about the past and present requires faith.
Firstly, there are some differences between the Bible and our records of the trip to the Moon. Our information describing the trip to the Moon hasn't been translated through a half a dozen languages, doesn't have the warped perspective of two thousand years to look at it through, and large portions of the information about the trip to the Moon are easily provable.
In terms of faith, I completely agree with you. I personally believe that God intentionally makes it impossible for anyone to prove He exists, so that free will will always be possible. The trouble is not that the Bible exists or that people have faith in it. The trouble is, that parts of it are considered hateful to some members of our society who put their faith in other things. You have the right to have faith in whatever you want--but you don't have the right to force me to conform to your faith.
Last point: There is no debate anymore about planet 10. It was confirmed long ago. :p :cool:
Who says?Quote:
Originally posted by Ya_know
Morally we all have faults, but homosexuality is just strange. I don’t want to be a part of a society that so easily accepts this as normal!!!
What if I say that bottom line, people named Ya_Know are just strange, and I don't want to be a part of a society that so easily accepts them as normal?
What is the difference, Ya_Know?
That's not FAIR!!!!
How many people are really named Wayward Clam????:p
Five actually. Nine if you count ex members, musicians, stage managers, and publicists. :D :D :D
In my best Arnold Horshack...ooh-ooh...I know!! I know!!!Quote:
Originally posted by Orangeman
That's not FAIR!!!!
How many people are really named Wayward Clam????:p
What do I win? :D Don't worry Clammy I won't tell them your name...er...oops!
You mean Wayward Clam's real name is Arnold Horshack?:confused:
Naw it's Ron Palillo ;). Ain't that right WC? :D
I don't know that Wayward wants his name shown all over WD's so that anyone can use it. After all that's the purpose of having aliases, so we can lay into each other without it getting personal...
Ain't that' righ Ron, ( I mean Wayward)
:D
Either you guys are really old, or I'm just outta touch, because I have no idea who you are referring to. :D :D :D
You have to be old enough to remember a hit TV series called "Welcome Back Kotter" Its the same series that gave John Travolta his start in show business. It was on around 1972 I believe and is still shown in repeats.
On that show was a nerdy character named Arnold Horshak (aka Ron Pellilo). This was before the word 'nerd' applied to computers. He never really fit in except the rest of the 'Sweathogs,' the gang he belonged to, were so dysfunctional themselves they didn't notice it.
Here's the website:
http://www.geocities.com/winddancer44/ron.html:D
Didn't he get his @$$ beat by Screech on that Celebrity Boxing show?