486 with W95 formatting 1.2Gb HD

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June 24th, 2002, 02:25 PM
Consultor

486 with W95 formatting 1.2Gb HD

Well, I've installed a 1.2Gb hard disk in a 486DX based computer. I'm trying to format this drive and install W95b on it, but, when I try to mount the partitions using fdisk, it only identifies 504Mb of free space at this drive.

The BIOS has identified the HD properly, there's no partitions on the drive... But, when I try to make the partition, it's just only 504Mb...

I have noticed when I run fdisk (from a w95b bootable floppy disk) it doesn't send me that message regarding "large capacity hd support", and that's my question. Is W95b able to format this drive (on this machine)? If it is, what do I need to do to enable this support?

Tks!
June 24th, 2002, 02:57 PM
freddy

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Consultor:
Well, I've installed a 1.2Gb hard disk in a 486DX based computer. I'm trying to format this drive and install W95b on it, but, when I try to mount the partitions using fdisk, it only identifies 504Mb of free space at this drive.

The BIOS has identified the HD properly, there's no partitions on the drive... But, when I try to make the partition, it's just only 504Mb...

I have noticed when I run fdisk (from a w95b bootable floppy disk) it doesn't send me that message regarding "large capacity hd support", and that's my question. Is W95b able to format this drive (on this machine)? If it is, what do I need to do to enable this support?

Tks!<hr /></blockquote>try to do it with a 98 disk from <a href="http://www.bootdisk.com" target="_blank">www.bootdisk.com</a>

i cant remember that far back !!!!!

i can remember on the LX boards that had a 8g limit and i had a 12g i used to put the drive in a BX machine fdisk/format and then put it back ,,,

yes i know u can use drive overlay , but its a pain.

fdisk/format using win98 disk on another machine should cure it.

note it may be as well if fat , to distroy the partition on a 95a disk

freddy
June 24th, 2002, 04:00 PM
edball

How old is the drive and what brand ? I've seen drives that needed a special program (overlay ?) from the manufacturer to work properly. You might also try changing the BIOS settings to a different configuration for that drive.
June 24th, 2002, 04:24 PM
Larommi

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Consultor:
Well, I've installed a 1.2Gb hard disk in a 486DX based computer. I'm trying to format this drive and install W95b on it, but, when I try to mount the partitions using fdisk, it only identifies 504Mb of free space at this drive.

The BIOS has identified the HD properly, there's no partitions on the drive... But, when I try to make the partition, it's just only 504Mb...

I have noticed when I run fdisk (from a w95b bootable floppy disk) it doesn't send me that message regarding "large capacity hd support", and that's my question. Is W95b able to format this drive (on this machine)? If it is, what do I need to do to enable this support?

Tks!<hr /></blockquote>I beleive 504mb was a bios restriction way back when. Around 94-95. Sounds like your machine may fall into that age catagory. The only way around this is a bios flash...good luck finding it, or an overlay program which is usually found packaged with newer drives. I forget the exact name of it but it tricks the drive into using all available space. I would check with the manufacturer of the drive.
June 24th, 2002, 04:30 PM
NooNoo

EZbios - and yes agreed larommi it is a bios restriction - Consultor - if you are lucky you have a flashable 486 board... and even luckier if you can find a bios for it!

Post the motherboard make and model and we will see what we can find.
June 24th, 2002, 04:49 PM
freddy

noo noo and the rest , i keep thinking back here ? IF the m/board recognises it then it "should" be ok (yes i know it isn,t) ,,,would suspect that this is/has been fdisked/formated using an earlier disk ??? (thinking hard) why is the machine seeing 1.?g then not allowing fdisk/format?

try the settings in the bios to set as lba OR even type the No,s in by hand _compaq style ,,,OR even fdisk/format on another machine.

this drive could have been used on a 504m machine and "still" have partitions (i know u said it dos,nt)

FtF
June 24th, 2002, 05:27 PM
Draggar

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by NooNoo:
EZbios - and yes agreed larommi it is a bios restriction - Consultor - if you are lucky you have a flashable 486 board... and even luckier if you can find a bios for it!

Post the motherboard make and model and we will see what we can find.<hr /></blockquote>I fully agree with this, I had a 486DX2-66 and wanted to put a 3GB HDD on it, I had to partition it into 4 drives (Max is 512 I think, so you might be able to partition it into 3 partitions)...

Use the Win95 version of FDisk and do not enable large drive support.

Good luck!
June 24th, 2002, 05:34 PM
NooNoo

That of course is the easy answer Draggar and Freddy :D :D , but if he insists on have it has one "large" drive then he is stuck with ezbios or a bios flash.
June 24th, 2002, 08:36 PM
shamus

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by NooNoo:
That of course is the easy answer Draggar and Freddy :D :D , but if he insists on have it has one "large" drive then he is stuck with ezbios or a bios flash.<hr /></blockquote>Been there , done that.Your stuck with ezbios (which IMOHO is EVIL :D )....but if you can find a bios update for a 486DX mobo that will get you past the 504mb limit let me know, I've got a bunch of 'em <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" />
June 24th, 2002, 08:43 PM
Garak

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by freddy:
noo noo and the rest , i keep thinking back here ? IF the m/board recognises it then it "should" be ok (yes i know it isn,t) ,,,would suspect that this is/has been fdisked/formated using an earlier disk ??? (thinking hard) why is the machine seeing 1.?g then not allowing fdisk/format?

try the settings in the bios to set as lba OR even type the No,s in by hand _compaq style ,,,OR even fdisk/format on another machine.

this drive could have been used on a 504m machine and "still" have partitions (i know u said it dos,nt)

FtF<hr /></blockquote>I agree mostly here.
if the BIOS correctly detects the drive then everything there is fine, the problem is software related here, not hardware..

LBA needs to be enabled

<a href="http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;Q255867" target="_blank">Microsoft FDISK</a>

<a href="http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;Q186057" target="_blank">How to Tell If Drive Overlay Program Is Installed in Windows (Q186057)</a>

<a href="http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;Q126855" target="_blank">Windows Support for Large IDE Hard Disks (Q126855)</a>

Try these articles - might hold information.....
June 25th, 2002, 06:23 AM
Platypus

Consultor, it does sound like the BIOS has the 504MB CHS (Cylinder, Head, Sector) limitation, if so there will be no BIOS option to enable LBA. Check carefully, though, some 486's had this option well hidden at the bottom of a menu scrolled off the screen.

If there is definitely no LBA option (it may be called Translation Mode), you will need to use an overlay (eg DiskManager, Ez-Drive) or update the BIOS if possible. (Note: some old ISA bus drive controller cards could also only see up to 504M, I got caught with that once.)

Don't be misled by the equipment sign-on screen correctly naming the drive, this doesn't mean the BIOS has identified the drive. Likewise, even if the correct values for Cylinders, Heads & Sectors appear, don't assume the BIOS can use them correctly; unless there is an LBA mode, it can't.

Also it isn't possible to overcome this by setting up the drive on another computer (eg multiple partitions won't help). You could, however, use another computer to confirm the drive shows up full size and can be partitioned to full capacity. This would give final confirmation the problem is in the 486.

If the 486 does have LBA and still sees the drive as 504M, or it stays 504M on another LBA system, as suggested it may have the left-overs of a previous non-LBA installation. You could try re-writing the Master Boot Record by running FDISK /MBR from a Win95b/98 boot disk. Or in the worst case, if the drive has been Low Level Formatted on a non-LBA system, it may need to be LLF'd again on an LBA-enabled system. If this seems to be the problem, ask for further advice.
June 25th, 2002, 10:58 AM
NooNoo

Platypus, is it also possible that this drive has a jumper restricting it to 504?
June 25th, 2002, 04:25 PM
Garak

Whats the model number of the hard drive by the way?
June 25th, 2002, 09:02 PM
Consultor

Well, people... Someone of your replies asked me to update BIOS or something else. I checked the BIOS setup program and there was an option to enable IDE 32-bit data and LBA to the HDD controller. :)

I've enabled these options and then FDISK started to ask me if I want large capacity disk support.

So, FDISK (from a Win95b bootdisk) could see the 1.2Gb hard disk. :)

But, when I asked to create the partition, the system hanged up with no reason. After thinking about various options (BIOS Setup, etc.) the last one I had was the HDD controller board (multi I/O), that was an ISA-16bit standard. Maybe to comply with FAT32, I needed a 32bit controller for this machine.

Well, I went to our "old technology commerce center" :p and I found a VESA LOCAL BUS 32bit controller to this machine.

After a little fight against its jumpers, this board started to run correctly and the drive was perfectly identified, partitioned and, finally, formatted, with all its 1.2Gb of space. :D

But I still have a little problem... :( I believe it happens because of its configuration jumpers, that are very complicated: when I connect the serial mouse of this machine, the machine doesn't start (the video doesn't initialize !!!). I've tried all jumpers settings but I'm unable to do this work. Without the mouse, the machine runs perfectly.

Thanks for everyone!
June 25th, 2002, 09:12 PM
Larommi

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by NooNoo:
Platypus, is it also possible that this drive has a jumper restricting it to 504?<hr /></blockquote>Possibly if it is an old Maxtor.
June 25th, 2002, 09:17 PM
Larommi

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Consultor:


Maybe to comply with FAT32, I needed a 32bit controller for this machine.

After a little fight against its jumpers, this board started to run correctly and the drive was perfectly identified, partitioned and, finally, formatted, with all its 1.2Gb of space. :D

But I still have a little problem... :( I believe it happens because of its configuration jumpers, that are very complicated: when I connect the serial mouse of this machine, the machine doesn't start (the video doesn't initialize !!!). I've tried all jumpers settings but I'm unable to do this work. Without the mouse, the machine runs perfectly.

Thanks for everyone!<hr /></blockquote>Ok I dont thing the 16 or 32 bit interface makes a difference on how information is written to the drive. Fat sizes ie. Fat16 Fat32 is cluster size.

Now the mouse thing is odd. I am inclined to say you have a conflict but since the com port is always on I would look at the mouse as being the culprit.
June 26th, 2002, 02:13 AM
Platypus

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Larommi:

Ok I dont thing the 16 or 32 bit interface makes a difference on how information is written to the drive.

Now the mouse thing is odd. I am inclined to say you have a conflict but since the com port is always on I would look at the mouse as being the culprit.<hr /></blockquote>I concur with 16/32 bit not relating to FAT32, that's true. The problem was almost certainly due to the design of the old I/O controller. The VLB controller could be a bit faster too.

If the mouse works on another system, I'd think the most likely cause of the non-booting would be a faulty COM port. Serial I/O controllers are a bit fragile, that might be why the board was "available". If so, :(

However, if you haven't already tried it, disable the COM ports on the VLB board completely, if the system boots OK, disable everything except the COM ports on the ISA board, fit that as well, and see if it works. If it does, it'll be a bit messy but you'll be able to use it fine like that.

And NooNoo, you're right, it could have had a jumper to set 504M compatability. I think they mostly appeared on 540/560 and 620M drives though, it's a real waste chopping back a 1.2G that much, and they were pricey then.
June 26th, 2002, 03:27 AM
NooNoo

Sounds like you are having major irq problems consultor, try looking in the bios for alternative serial port configurations.
June 26th, 2002, 06:16 AM
Platypus

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Consultor:
the HDD controller board (multi I/O), that was an ISA-16bit standard.
<hr /></blockquote>If this was the only I/O in the system, that is, no I/O on the motherboard, there won't be any adjustable settings in the BIOS, at the POST it will simply report the jumper settings on the card.

As NooNoo suggests though, it is one thing to check, Consultor. Most cards won't let you set conflicting IRQ's, but if yours has a complicated jumper set that you've struggled with, as you said, then it's possible.

When the system boots up without the mouse, see what the settings are for COM1 and COM2.

The standard settings are IRQ4 Port 03F8 for COM1 and IRQ3 Port 02F8 for COM2. If the card has let you set, for example, the same IRQ for both, it could cause trouble like this.
June 27th, 2002, 12:19 PM
davepoet

Just curious if you have tried getting the system to run now without the VESA I/O controller card. Now that you have the HDD problem fixed and installed, try plugging back in to the onboard port and see if this solves your mouse problem.

I had something very similar years ago and had to go through many of these same steps and problems.
June 28th, 2002, 04:55 AM
Platypus

Once you've got a system working properly with LBA, avoid doing anything that would cause it to revert to non-LBA (regular CHS) operation. A drive can be corrupted under these circumstances.

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