Best jabs at the convention

[jitBob]

Oh, you mean like Bush going AWOL?

Not Georgie. Georgie wouldn't do that. A little beer and cocaine and he might forget to show up, but AWOL, no, never.

[Zil]

Dry and boring? As opposed to stupid and irrational? Give me dry and boring.
Elect him because he showed personal courage and enough love for his country to risk his life defending it? Two really good reasons.
"At least I'm not President Bush" Isn't that what people say after they do something really stupid.

Thanks for proving my specific point:

he has no reason to elect him except "I was in Vietnam!" and "I'm not President Bush".

You gave no reason why John Kerry should be president other than the reasons from my quote.

[edball]

He didn't risk his life defending this country...he did some stupid sh!t over sea’s, forged his way to an early end to his tour of duty, then came right back to the US to protest the efforts of his country—all in direct violation of his commission as an officer in the US armed services. He’s a criminal if you ask me…and should have been charged with dereliction of duty, conduct unbecoming, and disobeying lawful orders…I wouldn’t go so far as to charge him with treason, but a borderline offender he certainly is!

I still don’t see how you can support this loser with such zeal, knowing all of this about him.

I think you should read his record before you criticize him. Especially the part about how he killed a Viet Cong and took a rocket launcher from him. Why don't you read them both while you're at it.

http://www.awolbush.com/kerry-vs-bush.asp

[jitBob]

I think you should read his record before you criticize him. Especially the part about how he killed a Viet Cong and took a rocket launcher from him. Why don't you read them both while you're at it.

http://www.awolbush.com/kerry-vs-bush.asp

Wow. What do you have to say now Ya_Know?

[TripleRLtd]

He didn't risk his life defending this country...he did some stupid sh!t over sea’s, forged his way to an early end to his tour of duty, then came right back to the US to protest the efforts of his country—all in direct violation of his commission as an officer in the US armed services. He’s a criminal if you ask me…and should have been charged with dereliction of duty, conduct unbecoming, and disobeying lawful orders…I wouldn’t go so far as to charge him with treason, but a borderline offender he certainly is!

Bullsh!t!! Plain and simple. You do know that there is a difference between being an ardent supporter of Bush, and just plain old anti-Kerry, right? Now you sound like techs and his virulent anti-Bush crusade.
Most officers with a brain in their heads came home or stayed stateside and were AGAINST the Vietnam war. In fact, the people from that era that I respected the most were the Vets against Vietnam. Now you are being blind, as if to be a patriot we have to agree with every move our country makes. Nope, sorry, a true American and patriot will indeed fight and/or protest even against his own country when the time is right, or wrong. Vietnam was WRONG, and Kerry was right to protest it, as were the thousands of other Vet's who did.

[techs]

I like the part where Clinton noted he is now in that one percent who are getting 50 percent of the tax cut. He was really touched how the Republicans now cared for him so much that they were willing to cut every thing else, health care, vet benefits, education just so he could keep the tax cut.
He was touched because he said "as you know when I was President some of the Republicans weren't very nice to me"

[jaeger]

Vietnam was WRONG,

Vietnam wasn't wrong, but it was stupid to get involved in. We are backed up by hindsight that trying to stop the Communists was noble, but we should have realized beforehand that there was no way we were going to win in Vietnam without going fullbore.

[techs]

Vietnam wasn't wrong, but it was stupid to get involved in. We are backed up by hindsight that trying to stop the Communists was noble, but we should have realized beforehand that there was no way we were going to win in Vietnam without going fullbore.

Which is why Presidents have to be careful what they say. "Bear any burden, pay any price" Sounded great didn't it?
I wonder what life is like for the average Vietnamese these days?

[cookin chef]

I know this jab may not apply to this convention, but I loved Arnold's speech about calling the California Democrats a bunch of girlie men!!!

[TripleRLtd]

Vietnam wasn't wrong, but it was stupid to get involved in. We are backed up by hindsight that trying to stop the Communists was noble, but we should have realized beforehand that there was no way we were going to win in Vietnam without going fullbore.

Tell me jaeger, what about our involvement in VietNam was noble? I really want to know. Was it this:
Read all about it: http://www.vvaw.org/about/warhistory.php

In 1945, the Democratic Republic of Vietnam was formed with Ho Chi Minh as the first President. American planes flew over Hanoi in celebration of the founding. The Vietnamese Declaration of Independence echoed that of the U.S.: "All men are created equal. They are endowed by their creator with certain inalienable rights, among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness...This immortal statement is extracted from the Declaration of Independence of the United States of America in 1776. Understood in the broader sense this means: All people on earth are born equal. Every person has the right to live, to be happy, and free."

Ho Chi Minh asked the Americans to honor their commitment to independence, citing the Atlantic Charter and the U.N. Charter on self-determination. However, by the end of the war, the U.S. government had begun to redirect its foreign policy from the wartime goal of the liberation of all occupied countries and colonies to the postwar anti-communist crusade, which became the Cold War.

Or, how about this:

According to international agreement, Vietnam was to be temporarily divided into north and south, with free elections to take place nationwide in 1956. Even before the French were out, the U.S. was moving in. Prior to Dien Bien Phu, the U.S. set up MAAG (Military Assistance and Advisory Group) consisting of 350 U.S. personnel operating in Saigon in support of the French. Between 1950 and 1954, the U.S. contributed over $3 billion to their French allies in the fight for Vietnam. By 1954, the U.S. contributions were providing 80% of the cost of the war. MAAG began to train a "nationalistic" Vietnamese force of a quarter of a million men. This force was largely made up of Vietnamese who had fought for the French.

Former Emperor Bao Dai had appointed Ngo Dinh Diem, a Vietnamese Catholic who had lived in the U.S. and Europe, Premier of South Vietnam. Though Vietnam was 95% Buddhist, the Catholic Diem was soon recognized as the future leader of Vietnam by the CIA and other U.S. interests. In 1956 the U.S. refused to go along with the promised nation-wide elections because, in the words of President Eisenhower, "Possibly 80 per cent of the population would have voted for the Communist Ho Chi Minh as their leader rather than Chief of State Bao Dai."

U.S. involvement continued and so did U.S. money and men. American presence rose to 500 under Eisenhower and grew to 15,000 under Kennedy. But Diem continued to be in trouble: former Viet Minh cadres helped to support a number of groups to oppose Diem and the French successor in Vietnam -- the U.S. The similarity between the French and the U.S. forces in Vietnam was, from the Vietnamese point of view, more than that both were foreign oppressors. Even our uniforms were similar, right down to the green berets. In fact, U.S. troops were known as "Frenchmen with money."

Tell me would ya? How, in fact was our involvement in Vietnam "noble"? And, how many blinded Americans believed in that policy...obviously, until today: with you, too?

[Major Kong]

Blame the frelling French and their sale guerre from 1945 to 1954 which came crashing down at Dien Bien Phu. You can actually blame it on the whole French Union concept and France's commitment to protect Laos sovereignty from the DRV.

Boy this subject could lead to several thousand pages of reply's.

[TripleRLtd]

Blame the frelling French and their sale guerre from 1945 to 1954 which came crashing down at Dien Bien Phu. You can actually blame it on the whole French Union concept and France's commitment to protect Laos sovereignty from the DRV.

Boy this subject could lead to several thousand pages of reply's.

Tell me about it Major!
And, nothing but BAD memories, and bad policies, and bad history!!
If there was EVER one thing that we should NOT have gotten involved in, it was VietNam!! So sad that we " had" to support France after their downfall.
So sad that we "had" to stop communism at "all" costs.
So sad that WE, for once lost, and deserved to.
So sad that we killed millions of Vietnamese who only wanted to rule themselves after a thousand years.
So sad that we defoliated 20% of their land and their people for our "own" purposes.
So sad that we, for once, made ourselves a mockery to to the world for the first, and sadly...not last, time in history.
And, so sad that it was BOTH parties that did it!! Not the Dems or Republicans, but ALL of us!! And our policy? Was it Imperialistic? Was it? Only time will tell! But guess what? To much of the world, IT sure is looking that way...and, really, who can blame "them" for seeing things that way? Tell me, would ya? Why does America look so bad in the eyes of the rest of world? I'll tell you: it ALL started with VietNam!!!
Even when "we" do a good thing like Afghanistan or Iraq, we will always pay with Vietnam.

[Major Kong]

Trip it could have been much worse!!! Have you ever heard of Operation Vulture? Thankfully on April 8, 1954 the Eisenhower White House rejected the French request for American intervention at Dien Bien Phu (DNP). However on the same day SoS Dulles offered the French TWO A-Bombs to save DBP. The French turned down the offer as they did not want to use nukes.

We came awfully close to full out commitment to war with Vietnam and China years before the escalation in the 60's because of the Domino Theory.

[TripleRLtd]

Trip it could have been much worse!!! Have you ever heard of Operation Vulture? Thankfully on April 8, 1954 the Eisenhower White House rejected the French request for American intervention at Dien Bien Phu (DNP). However on the same day SoS Dulles offered the French TWO A-Bombs to save DBP. The French turned down the offer as they did not want to use nukes.

We came awfully close to full out commitment to war with Vietnam and China years before the escalation in the 60's because of the Domino Theory.

Yeah, I do remember ( of course, not personally, but reading about it). Indeed, thankfully, cooler heads prevailed.
My question is: how often is that going to be the case with us humans with our "shoot from the hip" ways? One of these days, it is surely going to get the best of us all. What then?



btw Ya_k,
this was NOT meant as a condemnation of what you said. Sometimes cooler heads DO prevail. What you said was NOT one of them,
Kerry did his part in a lousy chapter of OUR history. So, take him up on his issues, or lack thereof, but NOT his part in Vietnam. Not one of us can be proud of what we did to, or for, or against, Vietnam. None of us!

[RIOT]

btw Ya_k,
this was NOT meant as a condemnation of what you said. Sometimes cooler heads DO prevail. What you said was NOT one of them,
Kerry did his part in a lousy chapter of OUR history. So, take him up on his issues, or lack thereof, but NOT his part in Vietnam. Not one of us can be proud of what we did to, or for, or against, Vietnam. None of us!

Does that mean that we'll never hear from the Democrats ever again about how Kerry went to Vietnam and was awarded some commendations? Are they going to focus on their issues, or lack thereor?